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THE Gun Toting Liberal Reaches Out To His Fellow Commentators -Slash- Co-Bloggers And Readers To Furnish Their Opinions On Any Of The Above Or Anything Else Political One Wishes To O-Pine On…
Here we are again — it’s “Hump Day” and there’s a lot to be discussed in the land of fables and outrageous lies politics. Too much for just one guy to cover as a matter of fact, which is why THIS is an Open-Thread opportunity for y’all (yeah, I’m from Alabama — we say “ya’ll” here) to cover what I’ve missed for the day and/or argue with me about my few short opinions on a couple of MSM articles I’ve found interesting…
H/T goes to Mr. Joe Lovell — one of our most prolific commenters on this site: Remember the Heller Decision by the Supreme Court Of The United States (“SCOTUS” — a.k.a., “The D.C. Gun Ban” case)? Well, it appears our 2nd Amendment Civil Liberty RIGHT to Keep And Bear Arms (“RTKBA”) is going before the “Oh, So Robed Ones” once again (SCOTUS Blog). This time, they’re going to consider whether or not the 2nd Amendment should apply to ALL states and ALL municipalites. GOOD LUCK with that one, folks. They already decided decades ago it’s alright for the individual states and municipalities to regulate our 1st Amendment Civil Liberty protecting Freedom of Speech, which has given the rights of tiny little “Red State Cities” and even tiny little “Red States” themselves to deem anything they wish to be “obscenity” and punishible by a prison sentence.
Not to be a skeptic, but if these jackasses in the SCOTUS will approve of censorship of our Free Speech on the state and municiple levels, they’ll either have to extend the same courtesy TREASON in the case of our 2nd Amendment Civil Liberty as well. Should the SCOTUS waver and go with the plaintiff in the case, they’ll have NO ALTERNATIVE but to revisit their ban on TRUE Freedom of Speech. Don’t get excited, fellow “gun nuts” — the SCOTUS has historically been and always WILL be GUTLESS when it comes to overturning what they love to call “precedent”, even if the REAL term is “Horrible and Unconsitutional SCOTUS Decision By Drugged Up Predescessors In Robes”. Again — best of luck on that one. That is, unless the wacko, far-right-wing Republican Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia is willing to flick his fingers in an obscene Italian gesture once again on this whole ZANY idea.
I might just have to create a brand new category called “Are You Frigging Kidding Me????” but for now, it’ll have to be filed under the existing one called “Duh!“. It appears Whoopi Goldberg is joining some of her other far-Hollywood-so-far-left-they’re-not-even-on-the-radar-screen brothers and sisters of The Arts That Other Planet called “Hollywood” in crying and weeping over the capture of Roman Polanski (Telegraph — UK) for anally assaulting a 13-year old girl — somebody’s daughter. What the HELL are you THINKING, Hollywood? Whoopi??? Pray for brains, Ma’am. Pray.
Folks — it’s time to write your Senators — you’ve got two of them in your state and it’s your DUTY to contact each and every one of them to demand they “just say NO!” to allowing illegal aliens to pilfer off of any sort of a public option We, The People may find ourselves willing to pay for in the end. President Obama promised us illegal immigrants wouldn’t be welcome in a public option and now the Democratic-controlled Senate is insisting they “won’t be allowed but we’re not going to be asking for I.D.’s either” (The Hill). Huh? Another one for the “Duh!” bin, folks. Click here to give BOTH of your Senators HELL for even THINKING we’d be dumb enough to allow such a thing to happen.
Annnnnnd, now it’s YOUR turn. Back to you, my friends.
***
The health care bill(s) currently floating around the legislative branch are thousands of pages of of exactly that kind of wording. It doesn’t say we will but it doesn’t say we won’t. It is why we need to start over, assess what we really aim to achieve, and look at approaches to achieve those goals with the least disruption of the private medical industry as possible. If there is the vast amount of waste and fraud in medicare that they say there is, then what are they waiting for? Go get it. If they are not going to include illegals in the bill the why not have a way to verify it? If the public is not expected to pay for abortions, then put it in writing. The public knows why the left is ambiguous on these and other points in the health care issue. which is why it grows less popular all the time.
@vegofish, It was, after all, Franklin D. Roosevelt’s brilliant “brains trust” advisers whose policies are now increasingly recognized as having prolonged the Great Depression of the 1930s, while claiming credit for ending it. The Great Depression ended only when the Second World War put an end to many New Deal policies.
FDR himself said that “Dr. New Deal” had been replaced by “Dr. Win-the-War.” But those today who are for big spending like to credit wartime big spending for bringing the Great Depression to an end. They never ask the question as to why previous depressions had always ended on their own, much faster than the one under FDR, and without government intervention or massive government spending.
Brainy folks were also present in Lyndon Johnson’s administration, especially in the Pentagon, where Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara’s brilliant “whiz kids” tried to micro-manage the Vietnam war, with disastrous results.
There is usually only a limited amount of damage that can be done by dull or stupid people. For creating a truly monumental disaster, you need people with high IQs.
@GawdDayumAmerica, When you say FDR’s policies “are now increasingly recognized” as prolonging the Great Depression I think you mean to say, “are increasing criticized as part of right wing revisionist propaganda because we hate everything liberal so goddam much we have to rewrite history to fit our fragile prejudices.”
@bad dog, Yep I guess thats what this guy is saying bad dog since its a direct quote from him that has not a single word added to it by me.
http://iusbvision.wordpress.com/2009/09/26/dr-thomas-sowell-fdr-the-new-deal-obama/
They Dayum White Trailer trash talking redneck conservative scumbags.
@GawdDayumAmerica, The biggest problem facing the the health care issue at the moment is that a large number of the socialists in the legislature are not really interested in “reforming” health care. They are interested only in a complete government takeover of the system.
Sorry, Whoopi. Art does not excuse crime anymore than athletic ability and wealth. The world will just have to live without Polanski’s genius.
For the “ARE YOU FREAKIN KIDDING ME” Category
I personally believe backed up by my own personal research that what is transpiring is the revelations to moderates that they had a “tactic” used on them rather then just discourse that managed to head in one direction or the other.
As more and more people are realizing the Aliskyization of America they are becoming angry and they are starting to open their eyes, look around and see this model everywhere.
Its in our schools. Its in the work place. Its in our universities.
America’s heritage is being slowly rewritten and revised to perpetuate a nation of socialists. FDR was a crappy president that kept America in a recession for almost an entire decade with his crappy policies. But now were seeing FDR proclaimed to be all that…and history rewritten to prove it….professors retooled to teach it.
Americans above everything want the truth. Good or bad they want the truth and as they are starting to become aware of the Alinskiazation of America they are fighting back.
Sorry Democrats but your time in the wilderness is fast approaching as its coming to light you attempts to drive America left with nothing but revisionist history and a culture of “CRISIS”.
Global warming anybody? Crisis…contrived by the left to promote CAP and TRADE type legislation to pay for their social programs.
Moderates are opening their eyes and starting to see how duped they have been by this strategy to remold America after their favorite socialist country.
I might just have to create a brand new category called “Are You Frigging Kidding Me????”I might just have to create a brand new category called “Are You Frigging Kidding Me????”
@GawdDayumAmerica, You lost me the minute you put “Alinsky,” which I associate with the Sarah Palin school of right wing paranoia, with “moderate,” which is somebody who doesn’t see a vast socialist conspiracy in their schools and workplaces because there isn’t one there.
You say FDR was a crappy president. Most historians disagree with you.
Either a) FDR was actually not a crappy president, or b) all historians are socialists intent on revising history so they can rob you of your wallet to fund social programs.
As a rabid, radical, fringe realist, I’m going to have to go with option A.
You say global warming was a problem invented so socialists could produce a complicated solution engineered solely so they could get more money out of your wallet to fund social programs. A majority of scientists—those not funded by oil companies, that is—believe that global warming is real and that human activity is contributing and accelerating it. Where they disagree is to what extent it can be slowed based on good energy policy.
Either a) global warming should be taken seriously as the best our scientists can do at understanding the problem, or else risk major consequences that we are already seeing in action right now and will get steadily worse for the ecosystem that sustains our food and water supplies, OR b) it’s a vast socialist conspiracy based on the Saul Alinsky school for radicals designed to fool you into giving money to the government for social programs.
As a screaming advocate for extreme sanity, I’m going to have to go with A.
Moderates are indeed opening their eyes. They are starting to see that the game is rigged not by government, but by the people who own government.
@bad dog, Jesus. In my limited experience around here, when DOESN’T alinsky get thrown in the mix. It’s like Godwin’s Law with this guy.
I’m sorry Im about to run out, because I’m ready to unload on this Polanski thing.
@Mr Furious, It’s really annoying when the secret Obama society has a real secret and then suddenly you find it plasterd all over the internet. Dang it. I can see why people are annoyed with me. Ive let the far lefts secret out and will continue to pound on it over and over and over again.
Because its the truth. Debate it. Prove me wrong.
@GawdDayumAmerica, Wow, GDA, you’re like a wingnut superhero. You tell Obama’s aides that they will be liable for war crimes by using drone aircraft in Afghanistan, and suddenly the Pentagon announces they will stop doing it. Then you defeated the Democrats on healthcare. Now here you are cracking an ancient liberal conspiracy to turn America into a communist country.
See Doster? THIS is how you act like a right wing pundit. You can’t just be crazy. You also have to be arrogant.
Oh, and GDA? When you say things like, “Liberals want to kill your granny,” it is up to YOU to prove YOU right. It is not up to ME to prove YOU wrong.
But wait, maybe I can play that game too! It might be fun!
Many people say, “GDA is the dumbest wingnut on the planet.”
I say this because it’s the truth.
Debate it.
Prove me wrong.
@bad dog,
Moderates are indeed opening their eyes. They are starting to see that the game is rigged not by government, but by the people who own government.
In this year’s annual Gallup Governance poll, 53% of Americans say the government should promote traditional values, while 42% disagree and believe the government should not favor any particular set of values. Last year, Americans were divided right down the middle, with 48% taking each position.
The shift in attitudes this year comes primarily from the political middle. *(Hello….you know…the moderates)* Independents’ views show a dramatic turnaround, from a 55%-37% split against government-promoted morality last year to a 54%-40% division in favor of it today. By contrast, Republicans’ and Democrats’ views have been relatively stable, with the former solidly in favor of the government’s promoting traditional morality, and a majority of the latter opposed.
Bad Dog I just dont know why you bother to debate with me. You know I do not throw things out here that I do not have solid reliable facts supporting them.
@GawdDayumAmerica, I don’t know why I bother to debate with you either. On that, my friend, we are in 100% agreement.
You totally lost me, though, when you said, “You know I do not throw things out there that I do not have solid reliable facts supporting them.” I see no evidence of this.
http://blog.heritage.org/2009/08/03/still-not-convinced-the-public-option-is-a-trojan-horse-for-single-payer/
This is a really good lecture by a house democrat explaining to her followers that the “Public Option” is all about the government taking over the health care industry and turning it into single payer health care.
Its all about the Democrats pulling a bait and switch.
Just watch the video on the page. Forget that its the Heritage foundation. Amazing the Alinsky tactics the democrats are flaunting openly now to get the country even more socialized.
@GawdDayumAmerica, Watch all the videos on this page.
Its the Alinsky model perfected. They all admit that they are using bait and switch on the public with the public option.
Additionally the last video has the president…BARAK OBAMA himself in prior speeches declaring that the public option is nothing more then bait and switch and that he does in fact favor single payer and that he envisions the death of insurance companies in 10-15-20 years.
I’m wondering just what sophistry Holder will come up with to argue that “the people” to which the 2nd refers is different from “the people” in the 1st & 5th which have always been held to be individuals, not the State.
I do find it intresting that SCOTUS is hearing another 2nd Amendment case so soon after the Heller decision. This also has caused the 9th Circuit to put its decision from the en banc rehearing of Nordyke because it did not infringe on the INDIVIDUAL RKBA on hold (the original ruling was that the county could indeed not allow a gun show on county owned property, and held that the states and other jurisdicitons were not free to infringe on the RKBA. Some of the hard core leftists on the 9th didn’t like that ruling for individual rights and called for an en banc hearing, a very rare thing for a court to do). The 9th is obviously not eager to look like a pack of idiots. Again.
Some would wonder.
The Obama Administration ended the practice of detention and removal of illegal immigrants caught during work site raids. Then, the Obama Administration decides not only shouldn’t they detain and remove illegal immigrant caught during work site raids, but they should give them temporary work permits so that those illegal immigrants will cooperate with prosecutors.
Now, the Obama Administration merely lets the employer target know it is coming to do a payroll audit, which results in the employer terminating the illegal immigrants it had been employing.
I kid you not. I’m surprised the Obama administration doesnt just grant amnesty to all illegals via a presidential pardon.
Would anyone know how to reference an old post I made a couple months ago? The one where I set up odds on stuff like the price of gasoline. I believe I set the strike date as today, 1 October. Speaking of predictions, if you don’t listen to Rush often, only catching bits of quotes grossly distorted. Rush made a prediction. Of the four cities being considered for Summer Olympics, Chicago, Madrid, Rio De Jeneiro, and Tokyo, Rush said Chicago would be selected. Rush said that the President of the United States, Obama would not go to lobby for Chicago unless he already had inside info that it was in the bag. Too politically risky if it wasn’t a sucessful bid. I hope Rush is wrong, nothing against Chicago but I’d like to see Rio de Jeneiro get it as it would be the first time ever the Olympics held on the contintent of South America. **Disclaimer- My wish that both Rush fails in his prediction and President of the United States Obama fails in his mission to secure the 2016 Olympics in Chicago in no way should be taken to mean I want America to fail, or any American teams to fail at the Olymics** I claim there is a difference between wanting a particular objective to fail and America as a country to fail despite some people’s views that they are one and the same.
@Mike 300 Spartans, I think the big shocker is that every one of Limbaugh’s predictions was wrong. I mean, the man is a super genius.
From the local paper this morning:
“As a candidate, President Obama embraced the idea of “direct diplomacy” with Iran and other adversaries.
Today, in Geneva, the United States and five other nations will meet with Iran. It’s the first time in 30 years that U.S. diplomats have participated directly in talks with the Iranian government. A one-on-one meeting also may take place.”
Wow, 30 years of history wiped out with the stroke of a pen. Seems like everyone who has sat in the oval office since ’79 has talked and talked with them. Offered trade, friendship, arms, aid in other areas. We have tried emargo, siezing assets, boycott, relaxing all of those, more offers of arms, aid, understanding, friendship. And for 30 years all the Iranian government has done is lie and vilify.
Now, suddenly, we are being told that for 30 there has been no contact, no negotiation, no attempt to have normal relations with Iran.
Something tells me that the talks will go something like:
“”[clop clop]
OBAMA: Halt! Hallo! Hallo!
IRAN: ‘Allo! Who is zis?
OBAMA: It is King Barry, and these are the Knights of the Round
Table. Who’s castle is this?
IRAN: This is the castle of Our Master Ruiz’ de lu la Ramper
OBAMA: Go and tell your master that we have been charged by God
with a sacred quest. If he will give us food and shelter for the
night he can join us in our quest for the Holy Grail.
IRAN: Well, I’ll ask him, but I don’t think he’ll be very keen…
Uh, he’s already got one, you see?
OBAMA: What?
ALLIES: He says they’ve already got one!
OBAMA: Are you sure he’s got one?
IRAN: Oh, yes, it’s very nice-a [To Other Guards] I told him we already got one.
OTHER GUARDS: [Laughing]
OBAMA: Well, um, can we come up and have a look?
IRAN: Of course not! You are English types-a!
OBAMA: Well, what are you then?
IRAN: I’m Persiain! Why do think I have this outrageous accent, you
silly infidel!
ALLIES: What are you doing in England?
IRAN: Mind your own business!
OBAMA: If you will not show us the Grail, we shall take your castle
by force!
IRAN: You don’t frighten us, Infidel pig-dogs! Go and boil your
bottoms, sons of a silly persons. I blow my nose at you, so-called
Barry-king, you and all your silly English kaniggets. Thppppt!
ALLIES: What a strange person.
OBAMA: Now look here, my good man!
IRAN: I don’t want to talk to you no more, you empty headed animal
food trough whopper! I fart in your general direction! You mother
was a hamster and your father smelt of eldeberries.
ALLIES: Is there someone else up there we could talk to?
IRAN: No, now go away or I shall taunt you a second time-a!
OBAMA: Now, this is your last chance. I’ve been more than reasonable.
IRAN: (Fetchez la vache.)
wha?
IRAN: (Fetchez la vache!)
[moo]
OBAMA: If you do not agree to my commands, then I shall–”"
@Joe Lovell, Yeah, the last time the U.S. held talks with Iran, they went something like this:
IRAN: Sell us some weapons, dog.
REAGAN: I can’t be seen to negotiate with terrorists.
IRAN: Sell us some weapons.
REAGAN: Well okay but only if you pay Israel, who will then use the money to buy small arms from South Africa and send them to the Nicaraguan Contras.
IRAN: What are your credit terms, infidel?
REAGAN: That way I can get around this pesky thing we have in America called Congress, which the Constitution rather bizarrely says gets to make the laws.
IRAN: Will you take a check, Great Satan?
REAGAN: It’s good to do business with you again. Did you see the look on Carter’s face when the hostages came home right after the election? Man, I can’t thank you enough for that.
IRAN: No. Thank YOU, Great Satan.
REAGAN: No. Thank YOU.
IRAN: No. Thank YOU. You are a good friend to Iran, Mr. President. I wonder if there will ever come an American President as good to Iran as you—a man who, acting on the instructions of God, will invade Iraq, my worst enemy, weaken the country, and free the Shiite majority?
Coming Soon: Fictionalizations of real conversations where Cheney does business with Iran while CEO of Halliburton!
@Bad Dog, if you bother to do do the least bit of research you will find that after Ronnie did his schtick with them, then GHW Bush tried talking with them. And Clinton tried holding talks with them. Pres. Bush tried holding talks with them.
So, nice try at a history re-write.
@Joe Lovell, You mean George Bush tried to TALK TO OUR ENEMIES?!?
Gawl, Iran’s part of the AXIS OF EVIL! How could Bush actually try to TALK TO THEM?
Gee, I remember the right wingers saying back in the day that it was treason (and an extremely feminine brand of treason at that) to even suggest talking to our enemies.
Who would have guessed Bush was a terrorist-loving traitor?
Now this time, I know for a fact, I am NOT fictionalizing history.
@Bad Dog,well, you can form the brass for that 40-60 from either ,303 Brit or 30-40 Krag. The Brit would likely be less expensive though. And have a good smith look it over to make sure it is safe.
@Joe Lovell, I think you were intending this message for somebody else, GTL maybe?
Global waming/climate change & the environmental movement.
Somehow the AGW scare has come to be equated exactly with the need for stewardship of resources and keeping our nest clean. If you doubt the 16 foot rise in sea levels, the 8 degree celsius rise in temperature that AlGore salivates over, then you must be ready to strip mine every trace of coal, dump raw sewage and industrial waste into every water way, and want to go back to the smoke belching factories and cars of the 20s & 30s.
Funny how the researchers who managed to get out of the AGW-scare industry have all been saying that the science and methodology used to support AGW is on the junk science level.
From http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/10/gore_and_google_pants_on_fire.html:
“The real truth is ever since the end of the last Ice Age, global sea level has been gradually increasing. The melting ice and snow from that bitterly cold event is continually trickling into our great oceans and seas. According to the often quoted IPCC’s Fourth Assessment produced in 2007, over the past 20,000 years sea level has increased nearly 400 feet (added – that is 0.02 feet/year). While that may sound like a lot, let’s break it down further. Over the past century the average sea level raised a mere 1.8 millimeters per year.
Gore and Google have conveniently cherry-picked and exaggerated a portion of the IPCC report which, as part of an obvious set of improbable, hypothetical scenarios states, “the collapse of [the West Antarctica Ice Sheet]… would trigger another five to six metres [16-19 feet] of sea level rise…that would take many hundreds of years to complete.”
The IPCC section from which this hypothetical is lifted is entitled, How Likely are Major or Abrupt Climate Changes, such as Loss of Ice Sheets of Changes in Global Ocean Circulation? The section begins with this disclaimer:
Abrupt climate changes, such as the collapse of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet, the rapid loss of the Greenland Ice Sheet or large scale changes of ocean circulation systems are not considered likely to occur in the 21st century…
That means that over the next 90+ years, even the usually enthusiastic global warming editors at the U.N. are not anticipating the kind of predictions that Gore/Google are spitting out.
The IPCC also states, “All studies for the 21st century project that Antarctic [ice] changes will contribute negatively to sea level…” (italics mine). That means there is more snow and ice accumulating on Antarctica than is breaking off and melting into the surrounding waters. In addition the 2007 report declares, “…for the last two decades…Antarctica as a whole has not warmed.”
Regarding the potential collapse of the West Antarctic Ice Sheet, the IPCC says, “…no quantitative information is available from the current generation of ice sheet models as to the likelihood of timing of such an event.” And, regarding the swamping of major cities projected by Gore/Google, the report reads, “…accelerated sea level rise caused by rapid dynamic response of the ice sheets to climate change is very unlikely during the 21st century.”
Regarding Greenland, the IPCC states: “…the total melting of the Greenland Ice Sheet, which would raise global sea level by about seven metres, is a slow process that would take many hundreds of years to complete…no quantitative information is available from the current generation of ice sheet models as to the likelihood or timing of such an event”
Note that the IPCC which the left holds up as THE authority on AGW, is basically saying that the Earth is warming, and sea level rising, at about the same rates as they have been over the past 20,000 years. Funny that these reports by the IOCC are NOT making the headlines.
@Joe Lovell, Here is a website I found as a great resource on the issue of global warming http://www.climate-skeptic.com/
It seems to have both the highly technical stuff which I admit I can’t understand, and also breaks it down in layman’s terms.
@Joe Lovell, I cant repeat this enough or often enough. One day I hope people get it.
“The threat is usually more terrifying than the thing itself.” Imagination and ego can dream up many more consequences than any activist. (Perception is reality. Large organizations always prepare a worst-case scenario, something that may be furthest from the activists’ minds. The upshot is that the organization will expend enormous time and energy, creating in its own collective mind the direst of conclusions. The possibilities can easily poison the mind and result in demoralization.)……..SAUL ALINSKY’s Handbook for Radicals.
Global warming is bunk. Its nothing more then a means to an end. The end is the liberal state in which liberals get to control every aspect of your life. To do so they must create crisis after crisis. They must………
“Keep the pressure on. Never let up.” Keep trying new things to keep the opposition off balance. As the opposition masters one approach, hit them from the flank with something new. (Attack, attack, attack from all sides, never giving the reeling organization a chance to rest, regroup, recover and re-strategize.)……SAUL ALINSKY’s Handbook for Radicals.
In other words the minute you say wait a minute global warming can be happening they hit you from 20 directions with supposed evidence from all these global warming experts. Some of them are Biologists, Chemists, Engineers…why even one on the list has a Phd. in Food Preparation.
Their goal….Cap and trade. Get it passed…get the money…spend the money on radical socialist programs. Consumerism is a crime. Being good little nanny state soldiers is the goal.
@GTL: I think the only logical and compelling reason to treat illegal aliens would be the fact that we don’t want them running around handing out easily curable but highly contagious diseases.
It’d actually end up cheaper in the end to treat the one guy with TB than to not and deport him six months later when he’s picked up by immigration and possibly have to treat the thousands of people he came in contact with.
Just using TB as an example, there’s a ton of other diseases that are easier to treat at the source than to treat once they’ve spread around a bit. Things like VISA/MRSA/MDRSA/MDRE/VRE/a dozen other acronyms that all amount to “Holy shit, antibiotics don’t work!” all of which aren’t too uncommon south of the border where you can buy ‘em without a scrip.
Also: A whole lot of liberals are pissed off about the kiddy diddler. We don’t care how much of an artist he is, nor do we care who happens to like him.
@GDA
Yeah, keep telling yourself science is all a big conspiracy. Don’t worry, your computer operates on magic.
I feel compelled to remind you: Weathermen are not meteorologists. They’re not an expert in anything but a big smile and an ugly tie.
@JThompson, some weathermen are more than that, some work on planting bombs to blow up the pentagon and become the heros of impressionable youngsters who end up in high positions and want to do to the country today what the weathermen failed to accomplish years earlier.
@Mike 300 Spartans, You’d kidding, right?
@bad dog, Well B.D. being you asked, yes, for the most part I was kidding. Rather than try to launch into an in depth discussion about global warming, which to be honest, I’m no expert, I just tried turning the snide remark about weathermen into a counter remark about the name of the terrorist group to which Bill Ayers belonged. What I actually believe about global warming is this: I believe man has contributed to the warming of the planet with CO2 emissions. I believe that the degree of warmth is no real problem. I believe even if there was a continued massive increase of CO2 it wouldn’t make any significant difference. To paraphrase an analogy I read but can’t find the link: Say you had a car that was white and slopped on a thin coat of red paint that made it look pink, science could determine that the darker color would retain more heat than the white, put another coat of paint and it changes from looking pink to looking red, increasing even more heat retention, but once it is really red, another coat of red paint is going to have virtually no change at all. The opinion is that while CO2 has had a measurable change, it hasn’t been enormous, and even vastly increasing C02 will have less of an effect than what has already occurred.
@Mike 300 Spartans, Yeah, but Mike, and this is a serious question, I hope you’ll answer it seriously, why do conservatives constantly drop little snide comments about things that aren’t true?
Like Al Gore said he invented the Internet? He never said it. Like Obama had any closer association with Bill Ayers than McCain, which he obviously didn’t? Like me catching either a very bad cold or flu this week is evidence to FandB that the Canadian health system is bad? And so on?
If you know these things aren’t true, and they are said only to caricature your political enemies, then you are basically stereotyping, based on a lie. Why? Just to score a tiny little point on a blog somebody might read and be fooled? Or does it make you feel better? Or do you think constant repetition of a Big Lie makes it true over time?
It’s a slippery slope, Mike. Next thing you know, you’ll start believing some pretty wacky things, like liberals hate rich people and corporations, and invented global warming so they could tax you and spend more on social programs for crack whore welfare queens, and that the government is going to take over the health system and euthanize your family.
And worse, you might become a stereotyped caricature yourself. It’s been known to happen to people on the Right.
I wonder if it’s because conservatives have nothing real to complain about, or maybe they do, and once they start complaining they can’t stop because it feels so good to be self-righteous or play the victim, so over time they make stuff up? It must be nice to be able to manufacture your own drug of choice!
Just curious about the mechanism that makes conservatives take the time to blurt out small lies.
@Bad Dog, Here is the quote. Al Bore being interviewed by Blitzer.
“During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative in creating the Internet.”
@vegofish, Lets see, Bill Ayers hosted the event that introduced the previously unknown politician Obama to his future constituency, not in the Alder room at the Holiday inn, but in Bill Ayers own living room. Not exactly a courtesy one extends to a stranger and certainly not one he extended to Senator Mccain. Your mouth must be so big that every time you open it, it must close your eyes and shut off your ear canals. and we know that it flaps constantly, so it is little wonder that you see and hear nothing besides the drivel that rolls from your your magnum mouth. I am sick of you and your one sided ideology. STFU
@vegofish, So?
He did.
Gore is a geek and smart (his intelligence being the reason why you find him boring, God forbid we should have intelligent people running the country instead of pretend cowboys who make decisions based on their ass, I mean gut). He thought the Internet was an important technology. While a Senator, he sponsored funding for its development. That funding, like a tiny snowball that turns into an avalanche, led to the creation of the Internet.
Here’s a lot more on this:
http://sethf.com/gore/
Oh, and you know what? There is a link to a great story about the guys who actually did invent the Internet, who give Gore tons of credit for helping them.
I guess the laugh is on you. Again.
Is their room on this green planet for your ego AND Al Bores?
There must be some environmental issues with all of the hot air produced by the vast amount self adulation. Lots and lots of people were responsible over many years in creating the internet, but only one took singular credit.
@vegofish, And blah blah blah.
Not “I took initiative in helping create the internet”,
Oh no, it was “I took initiative in creating the internet.” big difference.
The chattering class really should stop yapping and actually listen to themselves sometimes.
You know, we conservatives don’t mind cleaning up the mess you leftists have made of the country over the last 60 years, we just want you to quit talking so much and get out of the way, so we can get to work.
@vegofish, No, there’s no difference. There’s only you, one of many right wingers, willfully buying into and repeating small lies that make up your Big Lies.
I know you right wingers like to speak in code. You know, when you say Obama is a foreigner, you’re saying, “He’s black.” Luckily, I have a Wingnut Decoder I got out of a box of Fruit Loops cereal this morning:
Um, let’s see how I can respond after decoding … Ah, there. Okay, Vego, you wingnuts have done a great job “cleaning up” [destroying] the “mess” [middle class] “you leftists” [liberal government enacted by generations of liberal and conservative governments] over the “last 60 years” [a period of unrivaled prosperity in the history of the world], we “just want you to quit talking so much and get out of the way” [all die in a gas chamber], so “we can get to work” [pay a man $20 so i can perform fellatio on him in a public restroom].
Good thing I got this decoder! It works even better than the George W. Bush Subtitle Machine, which quickly translated everything Bush meant to be the exact opposite of what he said, which allowed me to understand him.
@Bad Dog, Bad Dog: ” Like Obama had any closer association with Bill Ayers than McCain, which he obviously didn’t?” — Now, BD, that statement is false on its face. I know Obama has tried to distance himself from Ayers, but the two definitely maintained a professional relationship and worked together closely on a number of issues.
For example: The Chicago Annenberg Challenge, an Obama fundraiser was held at Bill Ayers home in 1995 when he started his run for the Illinois State Senate seat being vacated by Alice Palmer, Bernadine Dohrn was employed at the Sidley Austin law firm when Obama was there, and others.
In fact, and I’m sure GDA and Vegofish will like this one, at least one of the “community organizing” programs that Obama and Ayers worked on was initiated by Saul Alinsky years earlier.
There really is no question that Obama and Ayers had a close working relationship. They were two liberal activists living a couple of blocks away from each other in Hyde Park. They were both very active in liberal politics on the local level, and in community organizing. To maintain that they didn’t know each other is to dispute the known facts. The importance of this relationship may be debatable, but their relationship is not.
@Fandb, Wow, the same old tired myths just get dug up every few months, they never really go away, do they? I guess when you belong to a movement that would implode if it didn’t get a daily dose of mock rage, you end up recycling (cue some right winger to cry out snidely, “So what, ya lib, ya should be happy, I’m RECYCLING, HAH HAH HAH HAH HAH!!!!”) (but sadly, even the usual right wing comebacks get stale over time).
Although, in my view, it’s kind of hard to top, “Obama’s the Antichrist.” It kind of trumps everything else. I think you could run with that every day and it’d never get old. I mean, it’s kind of hard to care about future spending increases that might be incurred because of healthcare reform when the Antichrist walks the earth.
Cuz, like, that means it’s the End of Days.
But let’s talk about the CAC. Obama was on the Board. Ayers attended six meetings. Wingnuts say it’s a radical organization, but obviously don’t understand the difference between an organization proclaiming it intends to “radically” change business as usual in education of children, and saying, “We’re radicals and intend to destroy America.” Because wingnuts are stupid or liars, I can’t tell which takes precedence on this one. And of course you bring up Saul Alinsky, which makes … me … sleepy … whew, I’m back … Anyhow, the organization was never any threat to anybody except maybe the status quo in education. But let’s face it. When you’re John McCain and you have a goofus like Sarah Palin on your ticket, and you have no ideas and all the old ideas almost destroyed the country, what the hell else do you run on besides a bunch of thinly fabricated lies?
And here’s the grabber: The People’s Forum published a list of people who worked with or supported CAD during the time Ayers was connected to it. Including Republicans. So apparently Republicans are okay with funding an organization associated with Ayers. (This can only be summed as, “McCain threw Chicago Republicans under the bus.”) Then McCain released a list of 100 former ambassadors endorsing him, and second on the list was Leonore Annenberg, [resident and chair of the Annenberg Foundation, which ran CAC.
So don’t worry, I won’t ask you why you voted for a guy who palled around with terrorists. Because Ayers isn’t a terrorist. He served his time and was rehabilitated. Basically, the whole thing was another Republican mock scandal that sought to score cheap points through lies, guilt by association, and harassing yet another private citizen.
But if you insist on playing the game of guilt by association, I can ask you why you personally pal around with traitors. GTL is a liberal and all liberals are traitors in the wingnut universe (because they belong to the Party of Hate), and you have visited his site let me think—oh MY GOD, HUNDREDS OF TIMES—which makes you a FRIEND OF TRAITORS.
Why do you pal around with traitors, FandB?
@Mike 300 Spartans, It’s too bad, Mike, I was really hoping to get answer from you on this. Maybe next time.
@JThompson, Just curious, how do global warming proponents reconcile the fact that temperatures have been trending downward for the last decade or so?
@Fandb, As my friends explain it to me.
1. The earth warmed up….duh…werk with me here.
A.)What happens when da earth warms up?
2. More plants grow…hello….knock…knock…anyone home?
b.)So what da heck does plants got ta do wid rising temperatures?
3. Biology 101. Decaying plants and foilage release maximum co2.
Yeah?
Yep. Sorry folks. But as the earth warms its actually the resulting end to the warming period prior to the advent of a new global ice age. Sun spots are at minimum….earth is fixing to cool.
Yes we are headed for global meltdown but its not global warming. Its global cooling.
All the data suggests this. The problem is that even the IPCC left out many factors in its now heard round the world shout……”"a discernible human influence on global climate”.
@GawdDayumAmerica, LMAO … WTF????
@GawdDayumAmerica, I know you have trouble following this so let me splain it one more time.
Co2 builds up…..proceed global cooling….not global warming. Anyways as co2 builds up the oceans become saturated with carbon and the tides that warm the northern Hemisphere move farther south. These warming tides moving farther south allows the northern hemisphere to drastically cool and as a result great big hunks of Ice begin forming.
Over 100′s of years the ice sheets move farther and farther southward covering foilage and lakes that are saturated with carbon. Covering these lakes and foilage long enough for the carbon to actually break down into its original form and re releasing oxygen back into the atmosphere.
As the co2 is scrubbed out of the air and the co2 sinks in the oceans, the tides eventually push farther northward warming the northern hemisphere. The ice recedes and the planet is cleansed of co2 while the oxygen is replenished. The warming trends melts the ice and the ice sheets recede. Foilage begins to grow again and we start all over again.
America and Canada and Northern Europe are the ones that are in trouble. Not Bangledesh.
@JThompson, It is the Computers of your pseudo scientists, you know, the ones that are more interested in maintaining and increasing their government funding than real science,
that are magic. Magically producing the sky is falling scare tactics.
This just came to my attention:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7qGWb0FLmo
“radical new claim of presidential power, that is not afforded by the Constitution…”
gee…if you look at his voting record on civil rights this won’t be any surprise. And, if youthe former junior senator from IL seems to think he is the second coming of Lincoln, it all makes sense – no trial, no warrant, no charges. Just lock ‘em up. Yep, old Abe locked up over 10,000 US citizens from the NORTH. And carried out genocide and terror against the south. THIS is the hero of the former junior senator from IL. Amazing how in 8 short months he has shown his true colours enough that the blinders are fall ing off of peoples eyes.
That guy from the Constiutional center needs to bone up on his American History if he thinks it is unpresidented.
maravillosamente, la informaciГіn muy buena
Hops up on her soap box… Ahem… Remember, GTL, you’re the one that made this an open thread…
So when in Rome guys, please try and refrain from behaving like Roman!
As the former director of the largest rape crisis center on the Gulf Coast, I happen to know that there were 261,000 rapes and sexual assaults in the United States, last year. 72% of those were never reported, of those reported, there was a 50% chance of an arrest, an 80% chance that the sexual offender would be prosecuted, and a 58% chance those prosecuted would receive a felony conviction. If there was a felony conviction, only 69% of those felons spent any time in prison; in total there was only a 16.3% chance that any rapists or sexual harasser would spend a day in jail at all. A sad testament in a country where 1 in every 6 women, and 1 in every 33 men are raped. These statistics are from the Rape, Abuse, and Incest National Network (R.A.I.N.N.)
For a rape survivor, the road from offense, to arrest, to conviction and sentence is filled with potential detours. The offense may not be reported, and the offender may not be arrested. Even where this occurs, the prosecutor may decide to dismiss the case or a jury may decide to acquit because they believe the victim is to blame.
Given all the points at which a case may be lost in the system, it is not surprising that many survivors ask whether it is worth even reporting the crime. If, and it’s a really big if, the victim does decide to proceed with prosecution it can take up to two years for the case to finally make it to court. Keeping in mind that most rape victims suffer from varying degrees of PTSD, it’s not surprising that they opt out. I would imagine that 30 years ago, when Polanski was initially charged, that his victim went thru an incredible amount of re-victimization at the hands of the system so why the hell would she voluntarily choose to go thru it again (in the press I mean). At the risk of appearing to be some crazed feminist hijacker, I’d like to share some stats that I find interesting:
* Approximately one in ten (reported) rapes result in time
served in prison;
* Nearly half of all reported rape cases are dismissed
before trial, drastically reducing the chance that a
victim will see her attacker sent to prison.
Given these circumstances, it is not surprising that rape victims express little confidence in the system, y‘all… From their perspective justice is remote at best.
Several years ago, I was awarded a grant to study ways of improving weaknesses in the system, I began by looking at each point along the way at which a rape case could falter…
From the Victim’s Perspective:
Do rape victims have something to fear from the system? Most of the victims I surveyed answered with a resounding, YES.
Unfortunately, the figures tend to bear out their concern. From the perspective of a rape survivor, there is less than a 2% chance that the attacker will be arrested, convicted, and sentenced to serve time behind bars. The “two percent response” of the system works
out as follows. Applying the figures to conservative estimates of the number of rapes nationwide, one may conclude that a woman has:
* A 2.5% chance of seeing her attacker convicted, and;
* A 1.9% chance of seeing her attacker incarcerated.
The First Detour: Arrest
An arrest begins the legal process in every criminal case. But, in rape cases, it begins the process of case attrition. Most reports of rape never result in an arrest. Simple division of existing FBI figures reveals that 62% of the reported rape cases never result in the apprehension of an individual for the crime. When you consider that approximately 2/3 of all rapes are committed by someone the victim knows, this figure is startling. After all, this is not a faceless car theft or burglary where the criminal is never identified; the victim has almost always seen her attacker and, in many cases, knows her attacker.
There are no easy answers to why the arrest rate in rape cases is so low. In some cases, the defendant cannot be located; still other reports may languish because of limited law enforcement resources to conduct the necessary investigation. These factors may explain
a less-than-perfect record, but they do not explain why more than 60% of all rape reports do not result in an arrest.
Prejudicial Attitudes:
One must consider what other factors explain such a high percentage of rape cases without arrest. Police officers who do not believe a victim, and therefore find the complaint to be without merit, have the power to decide that a rape complaint is “unfounded.” Unfortunately, the discretion to “unfound” a reported crime is often influenced by the kind of prejudices we will see elsewhere in the system. For example, scholars have speculated that the high degree of rape cases lost at the arrest stage is due principally to the “unfounding” of complaints by police officers, who are
operating based on stereotypes of violence that presume someone the victim knows is not a “real” rapist.
The Second Detour: Dismissal
Once a sex offender has been located and evidence has been gathered to show probable cause that a rape has been committed, the legal process has just begun. The road from arrest to prosecution is often complex. Unfortunately, in rape cases, this process leads too often to stalemate and dismissal, rather than successful prosecution.
Our numbers for the Gulf Coast area showed that a substantial number of rape cases were dismissed before trial. We found that, of nearly 2,000 rape cases
disposed of through the criminal justice system, over a two year period more than 1,000 cases were dismissed. That means:
* Almost half (48% with 2% margin) of all rape cases are dismissed before
trial;
* Nine out of ten rape cases that do not result in a
conviction are the result of a dismissal rather than an
acquittal;
* 25% more rape cases are dismissed before trial than
result in a prison sentence.
When these figures were compared to the dismissal rates for other crimes. We found that rape dismissal rates were significantly higher:
* A rape case is more than twice as likely to be dismissed
as a murder case;
* A rape case is nearly 40% more likely to be dismissed
than a robbery case.
Prosecutors often argue that they have a very high rate of “prosecuting rape cases.” Indeed, figures from the Bureau of Justice Statistics boast that 77% of persons arrested for rape are prosecuted. But this figure does not present an accurate picture of the reality of rape prosecutions. In the fine print, we are told this figure includes cases where prosecutors agree to charge felonies as minor misdemeanors (plea bargains), and that it does not account for the many cases in which rape prosecutions are dismissed before trial. Clearly, this number is not the proper measure of the number of felony rape cases that actually result in prosecution and time served behind bars.
Cases may be dismissed before trial for any number of reasons. For instance, physical evidence may be subject to scientific challenge (lack of DNA), or victims may decide not to testify. For most crimes, this leads to a number of “dismissals” before trial.
But, in rape cases, there is another factor at work. Prosecutors are hesitant to bring any case — whether it be a robbery case, an assault case, or a kidnapping case — in which the offender knew the victim. A Violence Against Women study conducted in 2001 of the disposition of felony arrests in New York City concluded that a prior relationship between the victim and offender is the most common factor which prevents cases from going forward and results in their “deterioration” in the criminal justice system.
This hesitation increases in the cases we call “acquaintance rape.” Even though many of these situations involve persons who barely know each other (think hot-shot movie director), prosecutors nevertheless tend to believe that these cases are extremely difficult to win. As more than one gender bias study has concluded, prosecutors “do not file
acquaintance-rape cases because they feel convictions are unlikely. Indeed, prosecutors have acknowledged this publicly, defending their actions on the theory that the prior relationship of the parties will make it difficult for a jury to find lack of consent.
Now then, no one expects prosecutors to bring unwinnable cases — cases that
could not meet the “beyond a reasonable doubt” standard. But, imho, prosecutors must also understand that there is more at stake in the prosecution of rape cases than an individual “win” or “loss.”
In rape cases the reputation of the system is at stake in every prosecution. When survivors hear that prosecutors will not bring cases if they happen to recognize the perpetrator — the kid down the street, the UPS delivery man, the father of a friend, or a famous movie director — that has consequences. Why report the crime if you know it will not be prosecuted?
Why pursue a case if you know you will have to fight barriers of institutionalized disbelief? Why believe in our system of justice at all?
The Third Detour: Acquittal
98% of rape survivors have no chance of seeing their attacker brought to justice — they have dropped out of the system one by one. At least 84% did not report the crime; 62% found that the perpetrator could not be arrested; and 48% of those remaining found
that their case was dismissed.
Having met these hurdles, a survivor faces yet another barrier — the jury. It has often been said that a rape case is more difficult to prosecute than a murder case. There are a number of reasons why that may be true, including the availability of witnesses or other
evidence. But, in rape cases, potential jury prejudice is also a significant factor. In general, prosecutors believe that juries are more likely to convict in cases where the offender is a stranger.
Based on information collected from the 3 states surveyed, we found that:
* Less than half of the individuals arrested for rape are
convicted of rape;
* This compares to 69% convicted for murder and 61%
convicted for robbery.
These differences in conviction rates tend to be masked by statistics that measure conviction rates only on cases that survive the dismissal process. Often, prosecutors claim very high conviction rates in rape cases, failing to acknowledge that many
cases are weeded out long before trial. Once in the courtroom, rape conviction rates are roughly comparable to conviction rates for other crimes, although jury stereotypes tend to affect the few acquaintance rape cases that actually go to trial. Studies have
shown, for example, that juries are far more likely to convict, perhaps four times as likely, in a stranger rape case as opposed to an acquaintance rape case.
The Fourth Detour: Sentencing
Sentencing is the final stage in a criminal proceeding. Typically, judges have great discretion in determining the proper sentence, although that discretion has been narrowing as more and more states pass determinate sentencing laws. Rape has traditionally been viewed as a crime for which heavy sentences have been levied — a
legacy of the day in which rape was a capital crime. Our figures showed, however, that rape charges do not necessarily mean a stiff rape sentence. We found that:
* More than one fifth of convicted rapists (21%) are never
sentenced to time in jail or prison;
* Almost one quarter of convicted rapists (24%) receive
sentences in a local jail, which typically means they
will spend about 11 months behind bars.
These figures show, dramatically, the differences in “theory” and “practice” present in our criminal justice system.
To ensure that our figures were meaningful, we used an extremely conservative methodology. Our figures reflected only convictions for forcible rape offenses, however those may be labeled in law. They did not include convictions for misdemeanor offenses or any offense “lesser” than forcible sexual assault. In theory, the sentences for
rape were very high; in the states we surveyed, we found that sentences for forcible rape often extend to life imprisonment. But, as our figures showed, many rapists were never sentenced to jail or prison at all, and many more served sentences of extremely short duration.
So, you may ask yourself, how can the practice vary so much from the theory? First, it can vary because judges have the discretion to vary it; they have the discretion to set sentences in rape cases. Second, it can vary because prosecutors have the power to recommend a lesser sentence. Third, it can vary because both prosecutors and judges tend to sentence all first-time violent offenders — including rapists — to probation on the theory that first-time offenders are less dangerous to the community.
Finally, the assumptions we all share have a role to play here — judges and prosecutors alike respond to the community’s assumptions. When we assume that rape by an acquaintance deserves a less severe sentence, then we are likely to find judges handing
down less severe sentences. When we assume that a rape victim is partially to blame for meeting her ex-boyfriend or going to a bar for a drink with an acquaintance, then we are likely to see less severe sentences. When we assume that a rapist who is young and otherwise an exemplary student and athlete is not sufficiently dangerous to send to prison, then we are likely to see less severe sentences. Or, when famous people like Whoopie Goldberg, assumes that a high profile, creative “artist” who’s managed to live a full and prosperous life doesn’t deserve to be in prison, we are likely to see less severe sentences (shame on you, Whoopie!).
If you’ve made it to the end of this long winded rant, BRAVO! Because at the end of the day, I feel it provides some pretty dramatic testimony of the power of our stereotypes of crime — how these stereotypes distort our understanding of violence against women and deprive individuals of the “equal protection” of our laws.
Steps down off of soapbox and blows kisses to GLT, for allowing the space…And to all of you for taking the time to read…
@Kaye Harris, Thats some heady stuff.
Just so you know. I read about 2/3′rds of it and skimmed the rest.
perhaps I dont do you justice but none of what you said surprises me in a nation that is obsessed with sex……good, bad or indifferently.
@GawdDayumAmerica, I can be a bit wordy when on my particular soapbox, so skimming is expected. ~smiles~
However, I think the stats quoted here speak to more then a “sex obsessed country.” And I do not believe that these attitudes are exclusive to the U.S. by any means…
Have you heard mention of rape being used as a legitimate act of war against women in Africa…? Or perhaps you’ve heard that raping one’s wife is the God given right of men in countries around the world?
Simply by making this statement:
“perhaps I don’t do you justice but none of what you said surprises me in a nation that is obsessed with sex……good, bad or indifferently.,” you prove my point that stereotypes distort our understanding of violence against women and deprive individuals of the “equal protection” of our laws.
It not enough to simply acknowledge, then shrug off the fact that rape happens so frequently, Mr. GDA. One has to work hard to overcome the acceptance of such things.
Thank you for your feedback.
@GawdDayumAmerica, So you think the reason why there are so many rapes is the U.S. is a “nation that is obsessed with sex.”
Brilliant analysis, GDA. But keep working on it. It’s lacking in just a little substance. And basic truth. But it’s brilliant.
@Bad Dog, Actually Bad Dog I pretend to not know much about this subject. Im not an expert on what she spoke about.
I replied truthfully that it is heady stuff.
We as a nation are in fact I believe obsessed with sex. Gay rights, Pornography, Marriage. etc…etc.
I simply said that given this nations preoccupation with sex what she wrote does not surprise me.
Its not much different then the amount of deaths that are gun related. This nations obsession with guns and gun ownership makes it not surprising that we have more deaths by GUNS then we do by drowning. I rather suspect that if we were a nation that was obsessed with swimming that we would have many more preventable drowning deaths then we do.
I simply responded to Her post, acknowledging that she spent a huge amount of time posting it and I appreciated her posting and expertise on the subject. I simply wanted her to realize that at least one person read what she took so much time to post.
@GawdDayumAmerica, If I failed to mention this before…Thank you for taking the time to read & comment on my reply. After many years of teaching, writing and speaking to people about rape, I do realize that it’s not a very comfortable topic of discussion. I think you were brave to address it at all.
@GawdDayumAmerica, I like how you say it’s heady stuff, way beyond you, but gamely take a crack at being an expert.
When you say “this nation” is obsessed with sex and violence, you are missing the point that our species is obsessed with sex and violence.
But if you mean “particularly” obsessed with sex, I think of the Republican Party. They actually want to pass laws telling you how and when and with who you can have sex.
In any case, you are skirting the topic of rape and simply repeating the same old tired “family values” crap.
@Bad Dog,
GDA’s assessment of rape as a predictable outcome in a “sex obsessed society” is a very common misconception. In fact, the idea of rape as a sexual act and not an act of violence is the most common myth associated with this heinous act. And, almost entirely responsible for our attitudes of blaming/shaming victims,and for the atrocious lack of prosecution of this crime in America, or anywhere else in the world for that matter…
Sadly, when most people think of rape, they think of the rapist as a twisted sexual sadist hiding in the bushes waiting to stalk his next victim, when in fact, “most” rapist are opportunist criminals.
Let’s take Polanski for example, as far as anyone knows, his history doesn’t indicate that he has ever been a serial rapist. He just happens to be an amoral a**hole, who saw an opportunity to drug a 13 year old girl and have all manner of sex with her against her will.
Now then, this may in fact lead one to believe that he was “sex obsessed,” but as a clinical therapist, I’d be willing to bet the farm that it was more a power-control trip that he got off on… because, THAT’S what rape is all about, not sex.
Thanks for reading and your input, Bad Dog.
@Kaye Harris, Don’t you put that evil on me Ricky Bobby.
GDA’s assessment of rape as a predictable outcome ………And, almost entirely responsible for our attitudes of blaming/shaming victims.
There is not one GawDayum place where I said this, inferred this or implied this.
Have a good day and keep up your work with helping the victims of CRIME who were raped, but you need to take a breath and realize that of the 150 million Males in this country a very miniscule percentage of them rape women….MINISCULE.. You remind of the immigration lawyer that sees INS officers in hiding with every client who is picked up for jaywalking and found to be here Illegally.
@GawdDayumAmerica, Now, now… My apologies if I’ve gone and made you feel like you are solely responsible for all the rape and all the bad attitude about rape in this country, GDA… I simply stated, that like the huge majority of people, both men and women, you are operating under the misconception that rape and sex are the same thing. Don’t be offended, I know that only a tiny number of men do these horrible things…Believe it or not, I really do like men for the most part… and God help me, some of them are even opinionated, overblown, misguided, Republicans…
Hey, is this still an open mic? Did y’all see that Sarah Palin’s new book is the #1 best seller on Amazon, a month before it is scheduled to be released?
Ya just can’t keep those republicans down. Especially not that girl from Wasilla.
@Fandb, You got one thing right, which is the most annoying people never seem to go away, even after they humiliate themselves repeatedly.
(Don’t get mad, I wasn’t talking about you!!!!)
@Bad Dog, If leftists had humility they should be humiliated every time Ms. Palin speaks.
@vegofish, Absolutely! As humiliated I felt as an American every time Bush opened his mouth.
@Bad Dog, “you betcha!” Bimbo’s do have an annoying way of popping up all over the place… Wonder who her ghost writer is? Maybe she’ll share & I can finally get my book published too, or maybe I should just kill a few brain cells…hmmm… Can’t imagine that woman could write a coherent paragraph by herself…Not that I consider myself a literary snob, mind you, I love fantasy fiction.
@:-)
@Kaye Harris, Kaye Harris this comment puts you in the trenches and negates any intellectual high ground you might have enjoyed with me.
When you start calling a fellow woman a Bimbo and talk in derogatory fashion about the missing brain cells of this or any other woman…well… welcome to the trenches. Your moral and intellectual soap box just got taken away.
See ya in the trenches. Kaye Harris.
@GawdDayumAmerica I do not pretend to any intellectual or moral high ground, sir. Just like you, and many others here, I tend to call a spade a spade…oops, now don’t take that as a derogatory euphuism either…Mrs. Palin has proved herself… ahem…intellectually deficient time and time again, imho. Furthermore, I seriously doubt that I’m the only woman (with half a brain) who thinks she’s a bimbo…. Heck, she was an embarrassment to many members of your own party as I recall… And go ahead and bring out your big guns, GDA. I’m not above rolling around in the muck of the trenches… ~Big happy grins backatcha~
@GawdDayumAmerica, Amen, GDA. Sarah Palin has certainly done nothing to warrant being called a ‘bimbo’ by Kaye Harris or anyone else. Maybe y’all have a different meaning for the term ‘bimbo’ than the meaning I associate with the term.
I’m sure there have been many times a ‘bimbo’ was raped, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t rape, and it doesn’t mean the rapist should suffer any less severe a penalty for committing such an act of violence. In the same respect, Sarah Palin was ‘raped’ by the media, by David Letterman in particular (not to mention Letterman’s tasteless comment involving statutory rape of Palin’s daughter by a pro baseball player), and by the left in general, all because she put herself out there to try to serve her country.
Welcome to the gutter Kaye. No more sermons about how terrible everyone else’s behavior is, you have no legs to stand on in that regard.
Just more of the same from the democrat Party of Hate.
@Fandb, “Welcome to the gutter”? WTF is your problem?
FandB, she took the exact same license in describing a public figure as you and everybody else here does regularly, and happens to be within server commenting rules.
When she lectured us, we were exchanging mindless personal insults and basically acting like jackasses, personal insults happening to be against server commenting rules.
So where you do you get off saying “welcome to the gutter,” and telling her she “has no legs to stand on”? I’d say she has plenty of room to claim the moral high ground.
But everything is political with you, isn’t it. Contradict yourself? No problem. Tell a casual lie? No problem. Repeat a debunked myth? No problem. As long as you get to promote your agenda, you don’t really give a sh**, do you?
Seriously, the renewable energy industry must not pay well, because I’m starting to think you’re paid by the word here. Sometimes I barely believe you’re even a real person. Sometimes I’m convinced you’re some right wing Turing Test.
And as for Sarah Bimbo Hypocrite Liar Palin, she is all of these and more. Maybe if she didn’t have an affair and have a premature granddaughter, quit her job halfway through to pursue this weird game plan of begin President, starting with a book somebody else wrote and a speech dissing her country that hardly anybody wants her to give, slander people without a second thought as long as it helped her, run Wasilla into the ground, brag about things she didn’t do, and more, then maybe she wouldn’t be such an easy target for abuse, and maybe you wouldn’t have to get so riled up seeing your hero criticized.
My suggestion to you is: Get a new hero. Because this one’s a loser.
@Bad Dog, I have patents in renewable energy, but that isn’t my profession. I’m in plastics and it pays very well.
I’m sure I don’t have to tell you what I think of your ‘advice’.
@Fandb, Then I won’t bother advising you to stop being a dick to yet another total stranger.
@Bad Dog, Bad Dog you really dont get it do you?
She is a clinical therapist for RAPE victims.
She is an advocate for women.
To then call another women a Bimbo just doesnt add up.
Sorry….It just doesnt add up.
@GawdDayumAmerica, And the Right Wing Nitpicking Award goes to you, my friend, for getting obsessed about a minor detail that doesn’t matter to anybody except other nitpicking right wingers.
So you’re right about one thing. I don’t get it.
@Fandb, And by the way, you saying Palin was “raped” by the media is exactly the kind of stupid thing I would expect an empathy-free wingnut to say. Nice way to make a joke out of a very real problem. Great way to casually denigrate thousands of women who were vicitimized by sexual assault. But I guess these things don’t matter to Republicans any more than any other facet of decency. All that matters to you is winning. What’s a few pawns?
@Bad Dog, So, what was that the left-wing liberal icon David Letterman said about Sarah Palin’s 13 year old daughter? That she was raped by a pro baseball player? Yes, that was it. But you defended him. It’s OK if the left does something, but just the appearance of impropriety on the right is a disaster. Yeah, right. Don’t preach to me, “Bad Dog”, you have no leg to stand on either.
@Fandb, Uh, I actually didn’t defend him. I barely even know what happened. I simply didn’t care. While it is part of every sane liberal’s duty to play Wack a Mole with the wingnut rage o’ the day, my brain can only handle so much inane nonsense from you people. You could be perfectly right (although I doubt it, based on the track record), but in any case it’s irrelevant to the discussion at hand, which you appear to be dodging.
@Bad Dog, I’m not dodging anything, but I won’t be playing in the gutter anymore either “Bad Dog”.
@Fandb, Okay, “Franks and Beans.”
@Fandb, Letterman’s a small “L” libertarian, my friend. Do a Google search on that one
@The GTL™, a very teeny tiny itty bitty L with a the an additional teeny little eftist
immediately following it. All very very small.
@vegofish, He criticized your wacky idol for being the wacky wingnut that she is, and that makes him a “leftist”?
Is there any real evidence for this, or are we supposed to trust your ass again on this one?
@Bad Dog, Do you have a buzzer on your nightstand that alerts you to my presence on the site?
Just my opinion stalker dog,just my opinion. Not sure why anything concerning Letterman or Palin would constitute need for it to be a matter of “trust” for you, But you do have some peculiarities.
@vegofish, Three things you should know.
First, while I’m certain a peculiar guy, as far as this site is concerned I’m a very simple creature. I think the Republican Party has been hijacked by fascist nutballs who spread lies and propaganda without regard for country or even decency, and I think it’s my duty as a patriotic American to a) fight those lies and b) embarrass dumbass wingnuts by subjecting them to their own logic.
If you don’t know that about me by now, you haven’t been paying attention.
Second, your existence barely registers in my brain. You are some entity named “vegofish” who says the exact same things as GDA and, when he’s on his meds, CLD. You love America, you hate communism, and you think Obama is the Antichrist and that the Democrats are Satan’s spawn. That’s pretty much all I need to know about you—that, and you’re impossible to reason with. Otherwise, you really have no personality to speak of and I have no interest in knowing you as a person. So if you think my day somehow revolves around finding your posts and responding to them, well, that just fits the paranoid wingnut profile.
Finally, anything you say is a matter of trust. If you say David Letterman is a leftist, and it’s obvious to anybody who’s not a blind worshipper of Sarah Palin that he’s not a leftist, then it’s up to you to prove that he is or enjoy this hot steaming cup of STFU I’ve got for you here. Ditto on your rants about socialists this, government takeover that. Either prove it, or drink your STFU. Because you have earned zero cred that I should trust your word on anything. After all the nutball things you’ve said, you could say the sky was blue and I’d doubt it.
@Bad Dog, Wow, you are an angry little Canadian aren’t you? didn’t your therapist explain to you the dangers of compartmentalizing everything, and everyone, Do you even realize how ridiculous you sound? Using words like antichrist satan spawn, nutball, wingnut, and dumbass to describe those with whom you disagree really puts your mental illness on display. Your presumptions that I should care whether I have “earned cred” with you or not shows an arrogance and narcissism that is oft repeated in your posts. I and others have once again indulged your unhealthy need for angry conflict far too much. Many times on on nearly every topic I or the others have refuted your outlandishness with logic and fact to no avail. Reasoning with the mentally ill such as yourself is futile, so I won’t bother with that any longer.
@vegofish, Wow, you’re a dumb little wingnut, aren’t you? First, I’m an American citizen, so you’re wrong there. Second I didn’t use Antichrist Satan spawn to describe those with whom I disagree—I was calling attention to the kind of language that wingnuts like you use to describe Democrats—so you’re wrong there. You seem to think I am demanding something from you, when all I am saying is if you’re going to say stupid things and present them as fact, as at least try to back them up or else people will consider the source (you’re a wingnut) and discount them immediately.
Three strikes and you’re an idiot. Thanks for playing!
@Fandb, and company…
And the Big Duh Award goes toooo (drum roll please)…
My o’ my, seems I’ve stirred you boys up like a nest of nasty, angry hornets… guess I got some ‘splain to do, huh?
Let’s start here…Nothing to warrant being called a bimbo, Vegofish? Really? In all honesty you actually believe that?
Or why I, as a self respecting feminist, would stoop to calling Mrs. Palin (or any other sistha) a bimbo, GDA…Hmmm… Let’s see …As I recall, she explained her foreign policy credentials to Katie Couric, as being able to see Russia from her house and because of the really important airplanes that fly over Alaska…” Duh! http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_video/main500251.shtml?id=4476649n
O’ and let’s not forget this brilliant statement when asked by Charlie Gibson if she’d be willing to go to war with Russia over Georgia: “Perhaps so….” Double Duh!
With Palin’s willingness to launch a possible war with Russia, I suppose it is a small thing that she has no problem with the United States invading smaller countries such as Pakistan, Iran and God only knows who else. As she has demonstrated so far, she is woefully ignorant of foreign policy and just about everything else, and not even very good at parroting the standard Republican line, i.e. “Bush Doctrine; what’s that?” Triple Duh!
Ok, ok, I know you’re probably saying to yourself just about now… “Our girl was the real deal, so she wasn’t as polished as the big guys, she was so cute & authentic (wink-wink)…she was a state Governor, a soccer mom, a pit bull in lipstick, a real go getter and dang good on the domestic front. So why then did she make this dire statement in a recent posting on her Facebook page? “… health care reform could result in an Obama-created “death panel” killing my infant son with Down Syndrome…” For goodness sakes, y’all, intelligent comments like this just blows the mind. Quadruple Duh!
Imho. Mrs. Palin discovered long ago what attractive women always learn: that her looks help her get by in situations where other women (and men) would bear the brunt of harsh criticism. Hence, her dubious distinction, again imo, as a Bimbo… Now then, I have nothing against being attractive as my Master card could attest… I love nothing more then a day at the solon or shopping with my girls for new shoes. However, I read boys, can even name a few newspapers… I try and understand the dang issues facing my country. Women like Mrs. Palin give thinking, professional women a bad rap. Course, I’m always willing to change my mind if y’all can stop callin each other names and convince me that I should, cause I’m just open to new ideas like that… So, tell me, if you can something Sarah Palin has said that shows any intelligence whatsoever???
Now then, perhaps I should clear up a few other things up for y’all, too…
This for example:
‘I’m sure there have been many times a ‘bimbo’ was raped, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t rape, and it doesn’t mean the rapist should suffer any less severe a penalty for committing such an act of violence. In the same respect, Sarah Palin was ‘raped’ by the media, by David Letterman in particular (not to mention Letterman’s tasteless comment involving statutory rape of Palin’s daughter by a pro baseball player), and by the left in general, all because she put herself out there to try to serve her country.”
On second thought, this really doesn’t even deserve a reply other then, DUH! I think this just might be the stinky fish folks ‘round here call a Red Herring… Wink-Wink.
@Kaye Harris, Yes, yes and yes.
One thing, though, Kaye, as you seem to be new to this site, which is the right wingers here don’t care about things like obvious truths and facts. Sarah Palin is a right winger and contradicts Obama, therefore Palin is a genius, perfect leader, inspiring public figure, etc. Basic common sense and truth have nothing to do with the level of debate that goes on here sometimes—make that oftentimes—make that almost always. Truth is not important to these people; only winning is. If they can put an issue into doubt for even only the most gullible, ignorant 25% of the population who are idiots skeptical about global warming but eager to believe every Glenn Beck conspiracy theory pulled out of his own ass, then they will lie, distort and argue just for that purpose alone.
It’s sad, but true. Which is why I’m antagonistic towards them. How does one find common ground with somebody who says Obama is the Antichrist? What am I supposed to say, “Well, maybe he’s a lesser demon like Beelzebub, but not the Antichrist.” On many issues, there is no he said/she said. There is only truth/lying. I figure they can lie all they want, but if I can present even a tiny price for that, well then it’s not cost-free lying, and hopefully keep at least one gullible moron out there from becoming their next house slave willing to vote against his/her own interests because Obama’s a Muslim Indonesian/Kenyan communist fascist socialist bad boy who wants to euthanize your family.
Unfortunately, every once in a while, it can get nasty.
Just explaining how things work around here as far as I can tell, so that when you get even more ignorant and bizarre retorts to the things you say that you believe all intelligent people take for granted … well, hopefully you won’t be surprised.
@Bad Dog, So what you’re telling me is these guys are like beating one’s head against a brick wall? And here I thought I might get a bit of reasonable back and forth discussion of the issues. I was wrong to lecture I suppose because after just a few days I can see how easily one might get sucked into the name calling… Thank you for the fair warning, BD.
@Kaye Harris, Don’t take my word for it! There’s always the possibility of some reasonable back and forth, particularly with Mike300, but with some it’s pretty hopeless, you just get the talking points repeated endlessly. Dive in, enjoy. But wear your helmet.
P.S. You were right to lecture.
@Kaye Harris, Per your request, a few quotes from Sarah Palin. Be forewarned, this is not the SNL drivel the democrats always like to quote as if Palin actually said it. Just a few, many many more can be easily found…
As governor, Palin hosted delegations from all over the world, including a delegation of Chinese officials to observe the delivery of rural health care in Alaska and a delegation of Canadian officials to promote economic cooperation and trade. “We live in an increasingly interconnected world and improving global literacy among our citizens contributes significantly to our nation’s foreign policy economic competitiveness and national security.”
On Education: “I think we have to get kids excited about school, which means refocusing some of our priorities. Right now, we cater, if you will, to about 30 percent of the kids who graduate, go on to get a liberal arts degree in college, and then come back here to work. I think we also have to cater to the other 70 percent by providing them with educational opportunities that will get them ready for the work force. I’d like to see public schools teach skills and provide job-training opportunities in a broader sense — to see a vo-tech curriculum in high schools.”
On the Environment: “I believe in protecting Alaska’s environment through fair enforcement of our environmental laws. Having a clean record on environmental regulation is critical to getting ANWR open and maintaining our fisheries mining, timber, and tourism industries. We can be good partners with out-of-state companies, yet still make sure that what we do is best for Alaska. I believe that we can balance the needs of the environment and the subsistence way of life while fulfilling this mandate. Alaska’s environment has provided me with many opportunities, and I want to perpetuate those opportunities for others.”
And: “I support development of our resources on a sustainable yield basis. I support land use policies that encourage multiple use and believe in the principles of land ownership by private individuals as a main ingredient of economic development.”
On the 2nd Amendment: “I am a lifetime member of the NRA, I support our Constitutional right to bear arms and am a proponent of gun safety programs for Alaska’s youth. I grew up hunting and fishing in Alaska, and I am proud to raise my children with this same uniquely Alaskan heritage. Anti-hunting groups who oppose hunting and fishing rights will be the winners if we allow them to pit us against ourselves. As an Alaskan with strong beliefs on this issue, I am confident in my ability to build consensus among diverse user groups and reconcile the many competing interests…”
It is disgusting that the cheap shot liberal media was able to take this promising female politician, one of the people, who was (and yet will be) a rising star, and attempt to destroy her career by misleading people so much. It is easy to put someone with limited experience into a situation designed to make that person look bad. Sarah Palin has a number of good ideas and a refreshingly common sense approach to politics that democrats feared mightily, so they lied and tried to destroy her.
Just another reason why the democrats have become the Party of Hate.
@Fandb, Why thank you for sharing… I can see how much more intelligent Mrs Palin became after she hired that ghost writer… As for SNL, I think Tina Fey’s Emmy for her portrayal of SP, was a marvelous thing… As for the comments I quoted, you’ll find them on CBS News. Com, ABC News. Com CNN,… the Washington Post, The NY Times and every major news publication in this country… Check it out for yourself, Fandb…I’m sure those guys over at Fox won’t call you a seditious-evil-lying-communist-who hates America just for taking a peek. Ha! BTW,relying on the Fox News Channel as your only source of news is like using MAD Magazine as a legitimate source of news. You may end up smoking wacky tabacy and your brain’ll get all mushy…
My Professional advise, and it’s free for a limited time only… Step away from Fox!
But seriously, thanks for the quotes… I really gotta find that dang ghost writer.
@Kaye Harris,
Let’s start here…Nothing to warrant being called a bimbo, Vegofish? Really? In all honesty you actually believe that? HUH? I’m sure I said nothing about anyone being a bimbo. But since you brought it up, a good description of a bimbo might be someone who would post a long winded essay on how oppressed woman are in our society, then turn around and defend and assist the media in personally attacking for the intent of destroying a woman because you do not share her political beliefs.
As for your comments about Palins ghost writer, I guess you just haven’t noticed Mr. Obama spit and stutter and ummm and ahhh his way through teleprompterless commentary.
Your post on rape victims was…long. Of course I agree completely that rape and violence against women is terrible and penalties for perpetrators should be far more severe than they are, but you come off as more of a militant than an advocate, who’s views are skewed by overexposure, and frankly when you make the claims right off that their are 261000 rapes and 72 percent go unreported, I couldn’t help but wonder how, if, so many go unreported how can you be so exacting in your numbers? I am sure you have a formula or method for making that determination, but it left me to question the accuracy of the stats for the rest of the article, as again being from someone skewed by overexposure. Now I am sure Bad Dog will paint me as a defender of rapists for my comments, but as usual he will be over dramatic and wrong. I am just telling you what i think of your piece, and whether your stats are skewed or not doesn’t change my opinion that a bullet to the head would more merciful than any rapist would deserve.
@vegofish, • Let’s start here…Nothing to warrant being called a bimbo, Vegofish? Really? In all honesty you actually believe that? HUH?. I’m sure I said nothing about anyone being a bimbo.
•
• (Actually that was a case of mistaken identity. This comment was meant for Fandb… My bad, pls forgive me, just getting to know all you guys & when you all sound exactly alike… well I’m sure you understand… it confuses a lady…)
•
• But since you brought it up, a good description of a bimbo might be someone who would post a long winded essay on how oppressed woman are in our society, then turn around and defend and assist the media in personally attacking for the intent of destroying a woman because you do not share her political beliefs.
•
•
• (Destroying a woman by calling her a bimbo? Are you kidding me… I stated an opinion, just like you have here: “…a good description of a bimbo might be someone who would post a long winded essay on how oppressed woman are in our society, then turn around and defend and assist the media…” I must admit, it’s been awhile, if ever, since anyone’s called me a bimbo, Mr. Vegofish… And a person’s political, religious, social, sexual, etc preferences would NEVER prevent me from advocating for their right to express their views… I’m all about free speech. Mrs. Palin has every right to make a fool of her self as far as I’m concerned. O’ and, whether it’s Sarah Palin, Kaye Harris or you, when we put our selves out there publicly we can certainly expect that not all the people are gonna agree with or like what we have to say…)
As for your comments about Palins ghost writer, I guess you just haven’t noticed Mr. Obama spit and stutter and ummm and ahhh his way through teleprompterless commentary.
(Personally, I (and a whole bunch of other folks) find the President to be an eloquent & powerful speaker. But then I’m sure you find Mrs. Palin to be wildly… ahhh…. motivational… I’m sure I don’t dislike her any more then you dislike our President. Nor, have I been as disrespectful toward her as you yourself and many others here have been to Mr. Obama. Am I to assume then, that because you find President Obama, another person of your gender, a terrible speaker that you would not advocate for his right to be free of physical threat?)
Your post on rape victims was…long.
(Agreed!)
Of course I agree completely that rape and violence against women is terrible and penalties for perpetrators should be far more severe than they are, but you come off as more of a militant
(this (militant) made me laugh. I’d be happy to invite some of my femeinatzi cohorts to visit this site should you want a clearer understanding of the militant feminist???)
than an advocate, who’s views are skewed by overexposure, and frankly when you make the claims right off that their are 261000 rapes and 72 percent go unreported, I couldn’t help but wonder how, if, so many go unreported how can you be so exacting in your numbers? I think I quoted my source for those numbers, http://www.rainn.org/statistics
(The 261,000 cases are rapes reported to hospital ERs and Rape Crisis Centers around the country, not the number reported to law enforcement agencies. What I intended to state, but was obviously not too clear about was that, and this is very important to understand, 72% of rapes reported to hospital ERs & Rape Crisis Centers do not get reported to law enforcement… Better?)
I am sure you have a formula or method for making that determination, but it left me to question the accuracy of the stats for the rest of the article, as again being from someone skewed by overexposure
(you have no idea just how over exposed, but I shan’t share the freak show here…~smiles~).
Now I am sure Bad Dog will paint me as a defender of rapists for my comments, but as usual he will be over dramatic and wrong. I am just telling you what i think of your piece, and whether your stats are skewed or not doesn’t change my opinion that a bullet to the head would more merciful than any rapist would deserve.
I started into a long statement about my surprise that what appeared to be an otherwise intelligent woman, obviously passionate about the treatment of women, would be so willing to accept the way Palin and her family have been vilified by the media. I have listened to Palin speak on a number of occasions, have not always agreed with her positions and still do not.
I have no intention of voting for her for President or any other office now or in the future. My only interest in this topic is how unbelievably wrong the media and the left is about her intelligence, you dismiss her achievments as the product of her attractiveness,and refer to her as a bimbo. this is of course, as you pointed out, harmless and just your opinion. I think a disturbingly superficial view for someone who is an advocate for the treatment of women. Was she unprepared for the national spotlight? Absolutely. I can assure you though, you would not leave a one on one with Ms. Palin thinking she is less than a very intelligent, very engaging woman. It doesn’y mean her have to agree with her politics or the way she presents her views, but to accept the liberal media, Tina Faye version of Palin does a disservice to all women.
@Kaye Harris, thanks for the clarification too. I guess I missed the part about them being reported to hospitals. I may be wrong on this, and almost certainly you will disagree, but think modern attitudes concerning sex and marriage contribute to the circumstances you point out in your article. Sexual promiscuity by both males and females has become more and more socially acceptable, if not socially expected in today’s younger generation. The institution of marriage has lost it’s significance in today’s society, particularly in respect to sexual relations.
Sex is everywhere in the media. Unfortunately,
young women today are expected to be sexually active before they are married. People trying to council youths to wait for marriage to have sex are ridiculed as naive and hypocritcal, instead of being applauded for trying to guide young people in the direction that is unarguably the safest, healthiest and more responsible position. My point is that as attitudes towards promiscuity become more tolerant, the harder it will be for women to convince judges and juries that the are victims and not willing participants with a guilty conscience. I think this is very sad indeed. My second point would be that it is the political philosophy that you defend and promote
that promotes the tolerance of promiscuity and sexual relationships outside of marriage. Forgive me if you are not a liberal, but I am pretty sure I am correct on that point. As long as society continues to accept that there is no morality issues concerning sexual relationships and promiscuity it accepted and worse expected and celebrated, woman will continue to
be left out in the cold by liberal judges bent on rehabilition and jury’s anxious to get home to see the next episode of sex in the city.
@Kaye Harris, Very interesting argument Vegofish. I think many have lost sight of, or tend to disregard the fact that, rape is a crime of violence and control/domination, not a crime of sex. That plays into your ‘promiscuous culture’ argument. If the judges and juries maintain focus on the violent crime aspect of rape, they would be less inclined to see the woman as a willing participant.
@vegofish, My favorite part of the Tina Fey impression was when she quoted Palin directly. Those were the funniest bits.
@vegofish,
@ Vegofish, you presume many things about someone that you do not know, sir. I will however, take it as the “getting to know you phase”. Prepare yourself, cuz I’m sure I’m bound to rile you up often
First of all, I take issue with your statement that by calling Mrs. Palin a bimbo, that I “vilified” her, or her family…I do not accept the “vilification” of ANYONE’S family… Have you read anything that I’ve written here about Mrs Palin’s family? I don’t think so, sir, nor will you. For your information, I believe in a person’s right to privacy, especially where their family & personal lives are concerned…. Even elected officials! As much as I do not wish to know about the secret sex lives of politicians, i.e. whether they’re a Democrat who has sex w/ an intern (who would shamelessly use that rendezvous to her own end, I might add), or whether they’re a Republican who would pay a male prostitute to have sex in a public restroom; I don’t care to know and I do not believe it’s relevant to their performance as elected officials. Therefore, why would I judge or even want to know if Mrs. Palin’s daughter had premarital sex and became a teen mother? In fact, as the mother of a teen daughter of my own, I feel a great deal of sympathy for her here… Now then, I‘ve no doubt that you’ll find my belief that a politician, like anyone else in this country, has a constitutional right to privacy and should be held accountable for their JOB PERFORMANCE, not their personal lives, proves that my liberal thinking is solely responsible for the moral downfall of this country.
Furthermore, and this will be the last time I reiterate this fact…my belief that Sarah Palin, is a bimbo, a dingbat, and otherwise intellectually ill-equipped to be a national political leader, has absolutely nothing to do with my position as an advocate for women’s rights! I do not find every single woman that I advocate for to be equipped for that job, nor do I think that I myself have the political savvy to handle such a position. But I will tell you this; if I knew I was going to be in the national spotlight and I was going to hold myself up before the entire world as a person qualified for that position, I’d dang sure read up on the issues and be able to discuss them coherently. Even if I had to hire an acting coach!
Personally, Mr Vegofish, I found Mrs. Palin’s performance on the national stage to be much more of a disservice to intelligent women then my reference to her as a bimbo does.
As to the stats… You were right, my initial statement wasn’t very clear. Further, I do not disagree that our cultural attitudes about sex contribute to the problem.. However, I don’t think this attitude is a modern invention. Here’s something for you to consider:
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/
Rape rates (and note that this just includes rape, not other sexual assault) have been dropping along with rates of other violent crime. The study on rape among college women was done in 1985, when rates of rape were approximately three times higher than they are now. That means we’re looking at a one-in-six statistic instead of a one-in-four statistic at that time. Are you comforted?
If so, don’t be overly. What this tells us is that, 1. Education is making a difference, or 2. Fewer people are reporting at all. The jury’s still out on which… So you see, Mr. Vegofish, it has less to do with Sexual promiscuity then you’d like to believe.
And then there’s this: “My point is that as attitudes towards promiscuity become more tolerant, the harder it will be for women to convince judges and juries that the are victims and not willing participants with a guilty conscience.” Though I do realize that you are trying to express here, your “outrage” that such things happen and possible suggest a way to help, this is exactly the attitude that keeps the rapist outta jail where they belong. Rape and sex have NOTHING to do with each other. One is consensual and hopefully, pleasurable… One is an act of violence.
Thank you for your thoughtful comment!
@Kaye Harris, You mis understand Ms.Harris, I do not blame the acceptance or tolerance of promiscuity for women getting raped, I blame that attitude for rapists not receiving justice.
You are certainly entitled to your opinion of anyone Mrs. Palin included, I still think it is a superficial opinion, not based on facts, but on edited, staged, media perceptions. Again, I assure you would not walk away from any serious discussion with her thinking she is a “dingbat” or a “bimbo”. You strongly disagree with her politics, I get it, but don’t dismiss her accomplishments or intelligence simply from small mindedness.
@Kaye Harris, Actually, the quotations were clearly from Sarah Palin’s time as Governor, no ghost writer involved. Nice try to mislead though. And no, they weren’t from Fox News, they were from About.com. I’ll give a little advice back atcha – getting all your news from MSNBC and Rachel Maddow is worse than just believing all the Hope and Change lies that Obama preached to convince all the mindless dem’s to vote for him.
And that coming from someone who voted for Obama’s teleprompter. Did you ever hear your god-king Obama when he goes off script? He makes Sarah Palin look like a Rhodes Scholar by comparison.
@Fandb, I really Rachel, and Hope & Change…
@Fandb, “And that coming from someone who voted for Obama’s teleprompter. Did you ever hear your god-king Obama when he goes off script? He makes Sarah Palin look like a Rhodes Scholar by comparison.”
Yeah, I know, tout your idol’s worst faults as a strength, and attack your opponent’s greatest strength as a weakness. Because truth isn’t important to you right wingers, only winning is. So what’s a little lie? Or a big one?
Nice try!
@Bad Dog, “truth isn’t important to you right wingers, only winning is” — if that were true, then it is just as true for you left wingers. Another case of the pot calling the kettle black.
@Fandb, Yes, you’re right, FandB, it’s disgusting the way the “liberal media,” which set incredibly low expectations for McCain and Palin and incredibly high expectations for Obama and Biden, would have the nerve to crawl into the gutter to show Palin saying what she said, which made her look like the doofus she is. How dare they not portray herself as what she intended? How dare they simply let her reveal her train wreck of a personality instead of sticking to the script?
It’s enough to make you watch only Fox News so you can get your propaganda 100% pure, with no reality intruding to make you have an original thought.
@Fandb, Your wasting your time FandB, If they chose to actually listen to Governor Palin then they know they wouldn’t be able to ridicule her. How hypocritical to claim to represent empathy and tolerance and then treat someone the way they do her, and basically any other person who disagrees with their ideology. I am seeing that the conservatives I know are far more open to the views of others than most liberals.
@vegofish, You lost me after “You’re wasting your time FandB…”
@Bad Dog, Unfortunately I doubt that I have “lost” you. One can hope though.
If I did though, happen to actually lose you, would you please stay lost? “Lost” does seem to be condition that suits you.
@vegofish, Keep pretending Sarah Palin is a victim of anything except her own arrogance, ambition and stupidity, and I’ll keep laughing at you. It’s simple quid pro quo. You’re in control of it, of course, but I benefit either way.
@vegofish, Alinsky guys.
Alinsky says……Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.
Thats what they are doing with Palin. Thats what they did with Karl Rove and we ended up with Rovian instead of Alinsky.
They knew what they were doing. They were and continue to use Alinsky/Rovian tactics against anyone willing to let them.
There is nothing here and they get their jollies getting right wingers upset over bashing Palin and then you spend all day defending Palin instead of the task at hand which is defeating Obama’s policies and keeping the spotlight on Obama policies.
@vegofish, Yes, indeed, Vegofish. That is what has become of the former democrat party, now known as the Party of Hate.
@Fandb, I think you mean to say, “now known as the Party of Hate to right wing idiots like me who blindly hate the Democrats so much I say the stupidest things.”
Isn’t that what you meant to say?
@Bad Dog, No, I meant that the democrat party has become the Party of Hate. Your hate-filled posts prove it.
@Fandb, Yeah, but you’re so hate filled that you would even come up with something stupid like “Party of Hate,” it makes me think that you are a hater and the Republican Party, via guilt by association, must be the real Party of Hate.
What do you think? Am I right?
Or maybe you could grow up a little, call the Democrats the Democratic Party like grownups do, and people won’t think you’re so filled with hate.
Just a thought. I know how you feel about getting advice from me.
@Bad Dog, The democrat party is the Party of Hate. You have proven it with your hate filled posts. Period. End of discussion.
@Kaye Harris, Actually Kaye I have no desire to discuss anything that takes the focus off the Obama administrations policies.
You can go off on this little corner of the Internet Universe and call Sarah Palin all the names you want. I come to this website for laughs. I go other places for serious policy debate.
Health Care. Cap and Trade and Immigration reform. If my Conservative brethren are reading I would hope they would remain focused as well to defeat the Democrats and their health care reform that will bankrupt this nation.
@GawdDayumAmerica, Yeah, Kaye, let’s not talk about how wacky the Republicans are, let’s stay focused on the real issues: Making outlandish sh** up about Democrats and repeatedly it endlessly. All this talk about how Sarah Palin is incompetent is incompletely irrelevant given the country’s crashing avalanche towards communism evidenced by various conspiracy theories launched by Glenn Beck’s ass.
@Bad Dog, Alinsky doesnt work anymore Bad Dog. Palin has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that the democrats are trying to deceive the American public with a health care reform that will cost this nation billions and billions if not trillions in the coming years.
Palin has nothing to do with the fact that Max Bacchus sent a nasty letter to a health care provider telling them to cease and desist from telling the truth.
But you go right ahead and Alinskize Palin. Ill keep throwing out facts and figures about policy that has everything to do with all those Americans you pretend to care about so much.
@GawdDayumAmerica, There you go again, going koo koo for cocoa puffs. I have no idea what you’re talking about when you speak your secret wingnut language, especially your outrageous claim that you will “keep throwing out facts and figures about policy.” I could only assume you were trying to be funny. Since I laughed out loud when I read it.
@GawdDayumAmerica, You are absolutely right GDA. In fact, Pelosi and Reid are very actively fighting against the posting of new revisions to the Health Care proposals on-line. In fact, they are fighting to abolish the rules requiring any new legislation to be posted on-line.
When We The People saw what the health care bill was REALLY all about, the uproar was obviously tremendous, but also Successful.
Our democrat “Leadership” can’t have We The People knowing what they’re up to. It makes it too hard for them to pass their SOCIALIST AGENDA.
@Fandb, There you go again, confusing “We The People” with “We the Hateful Wingnuts.”
@Bad Dog, Hah, you don’t have an answer so you go back to name-calling again. What a loser.
@Kaye Harris,
Hear, HEAR! I’ve had the pleasure of meeting Ms. Harris face to face and guys — I’m here ta’ tell ya’ — she’s a LOOKER! And Ma’am, that was one helluva great post, BTW. Thank you for contributing and please continue to do so
@The GTL™, Ahhh gee, GTL, Thanks for the sweet comps… It was a pleasure meeting you & thanks for the invite, tho you could have explained the dress code included a helment & combat boots ~smiles~ If it’s ok w/ you, I’d like to post a link to this blog on my Facebook page. I have a few friends that I think would love jokes that fly around this party.
@Kaye Harris, Sorry ’bout that, Ma’am… show your pretty face back up to Wintzells whenever, drop me a line and I’ll be happy to compensate by purchasing whatever spirit moves you at the time
Great post, great commentary and VERY important stuff, TOO. Glad you found us here and glad you seem to be sticking ’round
Blog ON! Oh, and yep — please post my link and bring those feminazis over here — give my right-leaning friends hell — they’ll love ya’ fer it
@The GTL™, No apologies necessary, GLT… and as a matter of fact, I’ll be at Wintzell’s after work tomorrow for drinks w/ friends ( and maybe some oysters, “fried stewed or nude”, makes no matter to my liberal self
). I hope you’ll feel free to join us.
@Kaye Harris, I shall give ‘er a whirl, my friend
@Bad Dog, I know you’re not talking about me, I’ve never been humiliated.
@Fandb, You were the last person on my mind, I swear.
@GawdDayumAmerica</a Perhaps we’re using different calculations to solve this problem… Where I went to school, 1 empty head + clueless + cutesy = bimbo…Do you honestly believe that opinion would somehow preclude me from protecting her right to be free of physical threat…?
@Kaye Harris, Frankly I believe you are nothing but another Bad Dog impersonator and one of his many personalities.
@GawdDayumAmerica, No such luck I’m afraid… you’re stuck with another Lib. Dang, GDA, think the neighborhood will be able to handle the diversity?
@Kaye Harris, Gawdayum America used to troll this site under the name Brainded, then another name before that, I think it goes back to some guy named Doomed. Each name comes with a different personality, I kid you not, each more grating than the last. Two are geologists, one of them from Australia but living in the U.S., the other from the U.S. One is an Appalachian. Every time I would contradict the usual right wing lies and distortions, he would throw his arms in the air (metaphorically, of course) in total bewilderment that this liberal blog would actually publish the views of a liberal, threaten to quit, then threaten to quit again, and again, a couple more times, then quit, then come back under a different name and personality. Of course, because right wingers see their own worst faults in others, he accused me of being a creation of the site’s owner, and now you—ain’t that cute? As if it takes more than one of me to think he’s an ass.
I’m becoming increasingly convinced that he’s basically a shill—somebody paid to troll liberal websites and endlessly parrot the latest right wing mock outrage, talking points, etc.
@Kaye Harris, always willing to debate policy.. Always. I just do not get distracted easily. Im paid by the GOP to make sure that the word is spread remember. Bad dog says it so it must be true.
@GawdDayumAmerica, Do not get distracted easily by what, positions you can’t defend?
@GawdDayumAmerica, Actually, I think you, CLD and Vegofish are all different cheeks on the same ass.
And that ass is paid by the GOP.
It’s true.
Debate it.
Prove me wrong.
@Bad Dog, I’m still waiting, GDA. I come here for “laughs” too. Come on. Make me laugh.