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McCain Stump Accusations Against Obama Don’t Quite Pass The “Fact-Check Smell Tests”, But Hey, That’s A-Okay Because At Least We KNOW Juan Sidney of Arizona PANAMA Ain’t No Stinkin’ Terr’ist Like SOME Folk May Be…
The non-partisan Ed Morrissey of Hot Air offers us some snips of the new and improved “Alpha Male” McCain and Palin strategy now that each of them have been “out alpha maled” by Senators Barry Obama and Joey Biden, respectively in their recent debates. Captain Ed and, I suppose, a few buddies of his, personally asked Señor Juan Sidney to take off the proverbial “gloves” and he listened.
Here’s the exact quote from Hot Air:
“We asked John McCain to take off the gloves — and he listened. …”
Great job, Captain! Go get ‘em, Sir!
Not only do our friends at Hot Air go onto pat themselves on the back for goading Panama John and Sarah Barracuda Palin into going for the proverbial “throat” (and hey — there’s nothing WRONG with patting onesself on the back — I do it all the time here — most recently, my “GOP insider hint” that the McCain-Palin ticket would do exactly that a full day before the first MSM outlet so-called “broke the news”), but then they go on to give us some snippets from the latest stump speech from Señor Juan S. McCain where he puts the blame on the Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac fiasco right square where it belongs — on the shoulders of Barry O-Bomber.
The Senator from Panama:
“Our current economic crisis is a good case in point. What was his actual record in the years before the great economic crisis of our lifetimes?
This crisis started in our housing market in the form of subprime loans that were pushed on people who could not afford them. Bad mortgages were being backed by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, and it was only a matter of time before a contagion of unsustainable debt began to spread. This corruption was encouraged by Democrats in Congress, and abetted by Senator Obama.
Senator Obama has accused me of opposing regulation to avert this crisis. I guess he believes if a lie is big enough and repeated often enough it will be believed. But the truth is I was the one who called at the time for tighter restrictions on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac that could have helped prevent this crisis from happening in the first place. …”
Of course, this is what the independent far-left liberal FactCheck.Org has to say about the claim:
Who Caused the Economic Crisis?
“… The McCain-Palin campaign fired back with an ad laying blame on Democrats and Obama. Titled “Rein,” it highlights McCain’s 2006 attempt to “rein in Fannie and Freddie.” The ad accurately quotes the Washington Post as saying “Washington failed to rein in” the two government-sponsored entities, the Federal National Mortgage Association (“Fannie Mae”) and the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation (“Freddie Mac”), both of which ran into trouble by underwriting too many risky home mortgages to buyers who have been unable to repay them. The ad then blames Democrats for blocking McCain’s reforms. As evidence, it even offers a snippet of an interview in which former President Clinton agrees that “the responsibility that the Democrats have” might lie in resisting his own efforts to “tighten up a little on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.” We’re then told that the crisis “didn’t have to happen.” …
(Snip!)
“… saying that Democrats killed the 2005 bill “while Mr. Obama was notably silent” oversimplifies things considerably. The bill made it out of committee in the Senate but was never brought up for consideration. At that time, Republicans had a majority in the Senate and controlled the agenda. Democrats never got the chance to vote against it or to mount a filibuster to block it.
By the time McCain signed on to the legislation, it was too late to prevent the crisis anyway. McCain added his name on May 25, 2006, when the housing bubble had already nearly peaked. …”
And, while we’re at it — one more “snippet” from another FactCheck.Org article:
“… Palin said that McCain had sounded the alarm on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac two years ago. …”
(Snip!)
Palin is referring to a bill that would have increased oversight on Fannie and Freddie. In our recent article about assigning blame for the crisis, we found that by the time McCain added his name to the bill as a cosponsor, the collapse was well underway. Home prices began falling only two months later. …”
But, again, I must say — NONE of this is nearly as important as the notion of the American People potentially voting an al-Qaeda, Hamas, PLO, Taliban, and Bill Ayers-ish “Weathermen terr’ist” sympathizer into office. While it’s often said “all politicians lie”; it’s a huge STRETCH to say this is the case with Sarah Palin and her submissive boss, Juan Sidney McCain — these are “little white lies” designed to keep the “terr’ists” out of the White House and what could be more important than that?
In complete agreement with Captain Ed here — you do what you’ve gotta do; you say what you’ve gotta say — as long as the strategerie works in the end. We simply cannot allow a “terr’ist” on Capitol Hill by NO means, folks…
***
My personal “faves” tonight on this issue: Marc Ambinder of The Atlantic shares a video of an audience member of a McCain stump speech calling Barry Obama a “terr’ist”; Andrew Sullivan of The Daily Dish — “… If you thought the McCain campaign couldn’t go any lower, you were wrong… “; Michelle Malkin joins the choir with Captain Ed by saying this shows The Maverick has common sense after all
McCain blasts Obama, Democrats for Fannie Mae meltdown | USA TERM LIMITS // Oct 6, 2008 at 7:45 PM
[...] Panamanian Senator Señor Juan Sidney McCain Goes After Barry Obama For Financial Crisis; Doesn’t … Sphere: Related Content [...]
John McCain Calls Barack Obama A Terrorist | Prose Before Hos // Oct 6, 2008 at 11:19 PM
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McCain’s campaign is grasping at whatever lies they can come up with to try and save his campaign.
McCain’s running mate is only doing one thing, stroking the Egos of the social conservatives. There are many social conservatives in this country but not enough to allow McPalin to win the election.
Thank goodness McCain and Palin are finally taking off the gloves. Like millions of Americans I’ve awaited the truth, while feeling frustration watching Obama get a free ride. Subjects like Wright, Farrakhan, Pfleger, Rezko, Ayers, and others, seem to have been off limits for discussion, when they go to the core of who Obama is. In defense of Obama, the media treats him like a sacred cow, and implies that since these subjects were visited at one time, they’re not fair game to revisit … but, why not? Like millions of Americans I’ve never been comfortable with Obama attending Jeremiah Wright’s church for TWENTY YEARS … suddenly quitting for political expediency, and then claiming that he never heard the racist, anti-American sermons going on there. Also, the Trintity church website has since sanitized it’s previous links on the ‘Black Values System’ … and, the ‘Black Liberation Theology’ which Obama sworn an oath to for TWENTY YEARS.
If that is all the GOP has they are doomed. They (Sarah and JMac), don’t come with clean hands, so it’s a risk to try this…just ask Hillary Clinton. Plus, it doesn’t look like the Dems are going to lie down and take it without dragging the GOP in the mud also.
Olbermann Gives “Special Comment” On Sarah Palin Radical Associations:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/06/olbermann-special-comment_n_132456.html
It always makes me wonder why the neo-cons hardly ever check factcheck.org and politifact.com for the answers. Why are they so afraid of the facts? It makes my brain hurt trying to figure it out.
As usual, GTL, your posts never let me down.
Howard-Are you so detached from reality that you think these ads are the truth? Really? This negative garbage is all the morally bankrupt mental midgets on the right have left. Conservatism is a complete, total and absolute failure. There’s nothing there. It’s time to sweep every conservative belief into the dustbin of history (except protecting the second amendment). John McShame was shot down while murdering women and children, then he left fellow soldiers behind and covered it up. Then he ditched his wife for a hot young heiress who bought his way into the senate so he could rig deals like the ones with Keating. He barely got away with that one. He’s been a deregulator ever since, so he’s directly responsible for this mess. Someone should kick his f**king teeth out!
McDirtbag promised a clean campaign. What a filthy liar! Thes last few days have been some of the dirtiest in the sorry history of presidential politics. They know they’re getting their ass kicked and have nothing to offer so they’re going even more negative than the already negative campaign they were running.
McBush offers more of the same. Repuplicrimes! The guy is pure scum!
wow…It’s silent this morning. I sense some folks are somewhat stunned?
Nope, just waiting for some sane posters to show up to argue with.
lol…me too…haha. I thought posters were getting tired of hearing the truth for once
JMac has one more debate to make a difference and I just don’t see it happening. In fact, I see a potential JMac meltdown in the 3rd debate. JMac seemed to be very unhappy and annoyed all night.
By the way, where was Sarah Palin? Biden had a funeral to go to but usually the VP Nominee will be at the debates.
She didn’t want to see her man get squashed as usual!
I wouldn’t doubt it.
I don’t see why John McCain wanted to debate Obama in Town Hall’s all over the country. Obama appeared stronger and more Presidential last night than JMac I think.
Next debate McLoser will still be a nervous, cranky old fart with no answers or ideas getting his butt kicked horribly once again. What a pathetic mockery of the maverick he really was, back when.
Well, in lieu of someone sensible to argue with…(sigh)..I guess y’all will do.
To start, let me pose a question. Before Sen McCain ran for President, did y’all enjoy the fact that he opposed the conservatives on nearly every single issue? If so, what happened? Panama John hasn’t changed that much. Especially as regards his economic ideas, I find him to be fully as unsatisfactory as Sen. Obama. As if it matters. Our fate is in the hands of central bankers ( thank you Jesus).
As an aside, Jerry and G, how does the fact that Geo. Soros, Warren Buffet, and Bill Gates are all Democrats fit into your class warfare scenario? Do y’all really have an ideology or is it simply a case of “the enemy of my enemy”?
Chuck, I hear ya! I think you would’ve done a better than JMac last night filling in for him at the debate.
The Democrats have more of diverse voting power right now…rich/poor,black and white. The Presidential conventions were proof of this fact.
I don’t see class warfare as being a big deal right now…not as much as the “culture wars” the GOP are currently spinning which seem to be more polarizing.
I guess the 3 rich men you mentioned above don’t seem have a big enough issue with Obama’s tax policy
“done a better job”
Jerry
“I guess the 3 rich men you mentioned above don’t seem have a big enough issue with Obama’s tax policy ”
And you find nothing strange in that? Seriously. Hell, I’m a “free-marketeer” from way back, and I think that’s odd. When 3 of the richest men on the planet support one party, I have to think there’s something in it for them.
Chuck, I can’t argue…you might be right. We’re talking politics and we all have a stake in this election; including the 3 rich men
John McCain is loosing his mind:
“My Fellow Prisoners,” McCain Calls Americans:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/08/mccain-calls-americans-hi_n_133037.html
The ere of “the era of big government is over” is over. It’s time for massive expansion of government programs of every sort. Socialized medicine. An Apollo sized green program. Huge public works projects. Reregulation of the financial industries. Massive increases in public education. Arts endowments. Kids programs. Peace Corps. Rebuild the military these corrupt/incompetent conservatives have squandered pursuing oil profits.
I’ve written my part on Senator McCain.
Well, here’s a funny.
As the campaigns near an end and the election is right around the corner it does appear inevitable that Obama (the antichrist) will win. It amazes me that so many Americans can be so gullible to be completely mesmerized by someone with very little experience and even less integrity. Obama may be a very smooth public speaker, all con men are, but he does not have America’s best interests at heart. Obama’s past associations with terrorists, racists, criminals, and other deplorable characters has been completely forgiven by the democrat sheeple that he leads. Our country is on the verge of becoming more socialistic than ever before in our history. The very foundation of our country will be changed irreversibly, and the end result will be the end of personal Liberty.
If you think William Ayers will have nothing to do with an Obama administration, and that he will have no impact on the future direction of this country, think again. The socialist agenda of the SDS will be unleashed on this country like never before. Obama has been highly influenced by Ayers and the SDS, as well as other professed socialists, during his youth.
The same goes for Pfleger, Rev. Wright, and many others that have not yet been scrutinized in the light of day.
If you think your guns are safe, think again. Obama’s policies regarding gun control are extreme, and have not been discussed openly in this campaign.
The problem with Obama’s socialist vision for our future is that it will sap the desire of Americans to succeed, to excel. Just as it has in every other country where it has been practiced, the rewards of excellence are removed and replaced by mediocrity. Sloth is rewarded and achievment is taxed. Small business owners whose taxable revenue is less than $200,000 have negative incentive to build their business to $300,000 and employ more workers because their tax rates will soar. Companies do not go from $200,000 businesses to multi-million dollar multi-nationals, they grow in small steps. These small steps will be cut short by a socialized system of wealth redistribution in a manner decided upon by Obama/Ayers/Wright and their cronies.
The principles that made America the greatest nation on earth will be replaced by the principles of socialism.
Good-bye U.S.A. Hello Amerika.
Fandb, I think your about 7-8 year’s late…George Bush already throught U.S.A, the corporate institution into Amerikkka. You left out a few k’s.
Anyways, if you honestly think JMac and Sarah Palin’s radical associations are not scarier, think again:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/06/olbermann-special-comment_n_132456.html
Oct 7, 2008 … Consider this: Arnold R. Weber is a McCain campaign contributor and a longtime Republican. He is an associate of William Ayers. …
newsblogs.chicagotribune.com/steve_chapman/2008/10/mccain-has-his.html – 79k -
McCain/Ayers Linkage Uncovered
Arnie Weber has given two separate donations, one for $1000 and one for $500 to the 2008 McCain campaign:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/10/7/01441/3274 – 25k
typo: George Bush “turned U.S.A., the corporate institution into Amerikkka”…maybe more of a cultural/financial digression is more like it.
Yeah, I know you’ve bought into the Obama rhetoric hook, line, and sinker Springer fan.
The point you’ve consistently missed is that Ayers and his philosophy have a very strong influence on Obama and his policies. Admittedly, Obama is very good at hiding his policies from all the sheeple who follow him. He is as smooth as any con man I have ever seen.
Whether someone who gave a donation to McCain’s campaign knows Ayers is irrelevant. McCain’s administration will not be influenced by Ayers and his socialist philosophy. Obama’s will be.
Daily Kos, Huffington Post, Keith Olberman – get serious, those aren’t references, they’re comedy.
McCain’s administration will not be influenced by Ayers and his socialist philosophy. Obama’s will be.
Your pretty psychic.
Ayers Linked To GOP Governor Through University:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/26/ayers-linked-to-gop-gover_n_121363.html
I didn’t vote for George Bush once or twice so I’m not that gullible. I prefer Ron Paul honestly, but he’s not worth my vote when John McCain has a chance to win. George Bush might as well stay in office if JMac wins.
Jerry
I actually agree with your last statement, although probably not in the way your meant it. President Bush is no more a conservative than Sen. McCain. To paraphrase that old white guy talking to that middle aged white guy:
“Mr. President, I’m a conservative, and you sir, are no me”…er, or something like that.
G
Unfortunately, something like what you call for might happen under Sen. Obama. If it does, expect the dollar to trade at par with the Venezualian Bolivar. There simply is not enough tax revenue in the western hemisphere to finance that expansion. It will be nice to be able to pay off my house with a single $20 gold piece though.
hmm…I hadn’t thought about it that way but I understand…pretty good points Chuck!
My understanding is that Obama’s primary purpose is to close the tax loopholes to begin with which have been a financial drain and a tax haven for the old boys crony network to finance “some” of the expansaion. However, I know that is a small piece of the plan. The tax system is a total mess to begin with.
Where is the blow torch when you need it.
Don’t let Obama’s lies and flowery rhetoric fool you, EVERYONE’s taxes will INCREASE under an Obama administration. When he claims that only those earning more that $250K/year will see an increase in their taxes he is strictly talking about Federal Income Tax. He will raise the ceiling on FICA taxable income drastically or remove it completely – That will apply to anyone earning more than about $100K. Just one example of Obama’s lack of truthfulness. He is an artful dodger. The problem is, when all the gullible sheeple elect him and he begins to enact his socialist agenda, we will all suffer.
It is ironic that after listening to all the people over the last eight or so years saying that they want a more moderate administration, they want someone who will practice bipartisanship, someone who will eliminate the greed and corruption that has plagued Washington for decades, McCain and Palin are the only candidates who really fit that description and both have a track record to prove it. But then all those people do everything they can to belittle the accomplishments and smear the records of those two candidates.
McCain and Palin really are the candidates the people have been asking for – they have both fought against their own party when necessary, they have fought against corruption, and they have worked in a very bipartisan manner in order to get the job done. The problem is apparently, that “and must be a democrat” should be tacked onto the end of the description, because it is just that Label that seems to be getting in the way. Other than that label, they do appear to be the type of politicians that everyone has been asking for.
“The problem is, when all the gullible sheeple elect him and he begins to enact his socialist agenda, we will all suffer.”-Fandb
America has been suffering for the past 8 years and the most of the same sheep you speak of, that voted for Bush will vote for McCain…not Obama.
Obviously not, Jerry, since the sheeple I am talking about are the sheeple who will mindlessly vote for Obama.
I’m sure you don’t remember how bad things were at the end of President Carter’s first and only term. Double digit unemployment, double digit inflation, even the MSM turned against him. Obama’s will be that times ten.
President Carter isn’t the reason why we don’t have a middle class today. President Carter isn’t the reason why John McCain hasn’t mentioned the middle class once in the past 2 debates. President Carter isn’t the reason why we don’t have a middle class today. The middle class was strong under Bill Clinton, and it has evaportated under President Bush.
As I said before, we might as well keep Bush in office if McCain wins.
Another interesting piece of information: “New Party member Barack Obama was uncontested for a State Senate seat from Chicago.” from an article in “Progressive Populist” magazine link here .
The NEW PARTY is a SOCIALIST political party of which Barack Obama was a member. Many references to his membership and involvement with the NEW PARTY can be found on the Internet, and even more have been recently removed.
It also appears that Obama was a member of DSA (Democratic Socialists of America). Some information can still be found at the Internet Archive Organization (archive.org).
The reason he was running “Uncontested” in the race for Illinois State Senate was because he managed to have his opponents divorce records released to the newspapers several weeks before the election. His opponent would have been Jack Ryan, Jerri Ryan’s (Seven of Nine from Star Trek) ex-husband.
We might as well elect Castro or Stalin if Obama wins.
America does, in fact, have quite an extensive Middle Class that encompasses the vast majority of American citizens.
Obama was a member of the NEW PARTY (NP) in Chicago, a SOCIALIST political organization, and the DSA (Democratic Socialists of America). See the Internet Archive Organization (archive.org) for information that has been recently removed from the internet concerning these matters. “From the October 1996 Update of the DSA ‘New Party’:
“… to support NP candidates this fall. Here are some of our key races… Illinois: Three NP-members won Democratic primaries last Spring and face off against Republican opponents on election day: Danny Davis (U.S. House), Barack Obama (State Senate) and Patricia Martin (Cook County Judiciary).” AND “New Party member Barack Obama was uncontested for a State Senate seat from Chicago.” From “Progressive Populist” magazine here
The reason Obama ran uncontested is because he managed to get his opponent’s divorce records released to the newspapers a few weeks before the election, which caused his opponent to drop out of the race. His opponent was Jack Ryan, ex-husband of Jerri Ryan (Seven of Nine from Star Trek). Obama will stop at nothing to get himself elected.
Obama is a Socialist. He has a socialist agenda and that will guide his actions as President.
We might as well elect Castro or Stalin if Obama wins.
Ok FandB two points. First whether Obama has a socialist agenda or not he won’t be given the same blank check to do whatever he wants by a “useless do nothing other than make myself rich and abuse ethics congress” that Bush enjoyed for the first 6 years.
Second the McCain in shining armor with such a great record doesn’t exist anymore. You are thinking of the McCain of the 90′s. He sold his bitch ass out from 2000 on to pursue a presidential nomination. If he was such an anti conservative conservative as you point out why can’t he get more votes? He should be perfect for Democrats in that regard then or at least the independants. So something is wrong here and it has nothing to do with Obama Kool aid either. His choice of Palin will do only one thing other than sink his campaign. He will have launched the first Republican female preseidential candidate in 2016 or 2020. Her political career will skyrocket after this.
Bring on socialsm. I know it’s hard for greedy, self centered righties to believethat many people actully care about the well being of others, but it’s true. Socialism is not a bad word; it’s not scaring us F&B, this catastrophic failure of greed based capitalism is scaring the hell out of America, as well it should. The government can, and will, do many things more efficiently than the free market. It’s time we got past the bogus belief that the market is always the best solution. You might as well belive in magic spells.
One of the primary reasons America can’t compete like we used to is that every other major industrial/postindustrial nation has socialized medicine. We are failing miserably to keep up because of misguided right wing market mumbo-jumbo.
Economies boom under so called tax and spend liberals, and they tank under spend and spend conservatives. We’ll probably be heading into a new energy boomabout the time Obama is sworn in for his second term.
John McCain just “might” loose in some republican states that have been red for decades…Republican conservatives are still a problem for JMac and might be causing other Republicans to keep their seats:
GOP Faces Tough Battles In Senate And Congressional Races:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/09/congressional-gop-faces-t_n_133218.html
I look forward to JMac finally has the b*lls to say these things to Obama in person for once. He’ll get crushed.
Good comments “G” and “LeftCoast”
nuff said
“causing other Republicans to NOT keep their seats”
Y’all can clearly see why I’d rather read this blog than any other in the world — What a discussion!!! BLog ON, my lefty and righty bros and sisses
OK girardia, I know you’re a socialist, that has been made clear. Most Americans, however, are not. If you believe socialism works, then you haven’t been paying attention. Re-read Marx, power corrupts and the leaders in socialist systems become corrupted way beyond anything ever seen in America because the system fails to provide the checks and balances that we have.
Who says American can’t compete??? We are the largest exporting nation in the history of the world. We are also the largest importing nation. Every other country in the world is trying to play catch-up with the U.S. Low wage nations can assemble things cheaper than the U.S. but that does not equate to not being able to compete. The U.S. has been so incredibly successful under its capitalist system that when our economy hits a bump in the road (as we are now) the entire world economy is jarred right along with us.
Left Coast – Not just a socialist agenda, even I was shocked when I found out that he is in fact a “card carrying” member of more than one socialist political organization.
His alma mater, ACORN, committing rampant vote fraud.
If the left manages to elect their god-king Obama, they’ll deserve exactly what they get. Even girardia will wretch at the true taste of socialism.
Howdy GTL,
My John McCain 3rd debate “meltdown” prediction still has legs!
Great articles by the way~J~
“If the left manages to elect their god-king Obama, they’ll deserve exactly what they get. Even girardia will wretch at the true taste of socialism.”
If what we are experiencing right now is the best capitalism has to offer then maybe something else is worth trying. But then again there never has been pure capitalism or socialism for that matter. There will always be a corruption of each. Even communist china has it’s capitalist side. So even the day after Obama is elected FandB there will be a reason to wake up and notice the sun still shines and birds still chirp. As much as you think the world will end it will still be better than what we have endured for the last 8 years.
It’s been a while since I read any Marx but I believe that he said that when capitalism implodes, the government would have to bail out the banks and corporations, and that would be the beginning of communism. We are witnessing the birth of the first true communist state to exist in the world. All the bogus wars we have fought against so called communism have been against authoritarian dictatorshps, not against communism. Communism, according to my recollection of what little exposure I had to Marx many years ago in one of those liberal colleges, is a fusion of capitalism and socialism. Our current leaders are a ten on a ten-point scale of corruption so there is nothing to fear there. Bush is not a better man than Hussein was, and he deserves a hanging just like Saddam’s, except our hanging should be pay per view to genrate some money to compensate the troups he has abused, like his pal McShame, who votes against their best interests almost every time he gets a chance. Global unionization will bring the low wage workers of thes other contries a better living, and will stop our jobs from hemmoraging away.
Obama didn’t need to vote differently than his party because they aren’t on the wrong side of every issue, like the GOP is. In the old days, McLame would make a showing of disagreeing with the GOP once in a while, and sometimes he would even enter a vote that way, but usually he would vote along with the crowd. Since 2000, when he sold his soul, he’s flip-flopped on every single thing that made him appear to be a maverick. Now he’s just a piece of sh!t that needs to go sit in an old folks home till he dies.
troops
G – Wrong. Bush is a much, much better man than Saddam Hussein was. Now you’re just playing Jerry’s game of contradicting everything with no thought or meaning.
Left Coast – I’m curious, what is it exactly that you have endured for the last 8 years that would make you prefer socialism???
You’re right about China. Their system was an utter failure, and they realized it. So they opened up their zones of capitalism which are prospering and carrying the economy of the entire country.
No. Bush is a truly evil and terrible man who, along with his entire cabinet, really does deserve the death penalty, and it is apalling that much of America fails to see this.
wow! You guys have been going at it this morning!
Left & Girardia, I agree. Also, George Bush is definitely in Sadam’s category of being a rogue war criminal…just ask the united nations who are after Bush and Cheney right now for war crimes…not to mention the ripping apart of our civil liberties over the past 6 or so years. Has the constituion changed under Bush? YES!
George Bush is more of a terrorist to his own people and other nations than Obama will ever be on any day of the week; and John McCain is just a continuation of Bush. In fact, JMac “the erratic” is a tad bit more trigger happy out of the three. now that is SCARY!
Fandb, it looks like the flock of sheep you spoke of a day or so ago are starting to wake up:
McCain losing support among working-class white voters:
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/nation/politics/bal-mccain1010,0,3621895.story
The truth is that any society cannot function being purely Capitalistic or Socialistic. A society functions better when both systems keep checks and balances on each other. Sort of like Yin and yang when one has more influence the society becomes sick and needs an adjustment.
A balanced society is a healthy society, neither system works in its purist form but both having a balanced impact on society leads to a well balanced society that meets the needs and expectations of all members of the society.
This relationship works as long as Civil Liberties are held in highest regard.
FandB I never said I’d prefer socialism so please don’t put words in my mouth (or post for that matter). I said try something different.
And what is it I have endured for the last 8 years that makes me dislike our current brand of capitalism? We can start with CEO pay and the boards that support the cronyism and “I’ll wash your back if you wash mine” approach to salary managment. Throw into that every greed driven “executive compensation consulting firm” that promotes the practice to stay in and increase its business. How about health care costs and the abuse of that system by insurance companies, lawyers, and physicians. Then we can move to the deregulators and Enron. Sure worked out great for California (NOT) despite Bush’s and the AG insistence no laws were broken. How about gas prices and oil industry mergers resulting in NO competition, legal micropricing but no transparency about how this is actually managed to ensure “healthy market competition” and protection for the consumer against this oligopoly. How about NO abilty for anyone to follow the money trail in derivatives and hedge funds for the last 8 years (never mind even be able to explain how it works) right up to AIG, Lehman, Fannie and Freddie etc etc.
Capitalism with it’s assumption that the market will correct itself and therefor all will be well if we let it is BS because every remedy is funded by hard working people who are robbed blind by this brand of capitalism when the corporate elite and politicians end up circling the drain.
There are a few very rich wealthy people with access to high positions and influence who have the ability to pull and manipulate the levers of economic power to thier own self interest and trust me it is self interest at the expense of everyone else, especially the middle class. We HAVE to exist because we are the only ones who can bail the greedy bastards out when their house of cards come down.
That is just the short list of why I think the American brand of capitalism is broken and stacked in favor of the wealthy and needs to be changed. Did I say sociasm is the anser, NO I didn’t. Do I think a whole bucket load of regulation is required at this point? Yes I do.
Left Coast – All the things you described have been going on for decades, including the Clinton administration. None of this will change under Obama either, but your taxes WILL be higher – much higher. Obama is as corrupt as any politician to ever set foot in DC. In two years he took more bribes from Fannie and Freddie than anyone except Chris Dodd, and Dodd has been at it a lot longer.
Further, many of the issues you bring up were issues that Gov. Palin SUCCESSFULLY fought against in Alaska. This is something Obama has never done.
I agree with Ole Blue’s comments … within reason. I also agree with you that more regulation is needed (so does McCain); as both candidates are saying – transparency and oversight.
Capitalism, by its nature, has to be somewhat stacked in favor of the “wealthy”. In the United States, EVERYONE has the opportunity to become wealthy if that is what they choose to do. But no one is required to, if you just want to kick back and take it easy, you can do that too. Under an Obama regime, you won’t have so many choices.
Fandb, Gov. Palin is an Anti-American.
FandB you asked why I was so dissatisfied and I answered that.
Your opinion of the whos and hows it will be better or worse under I didn’t ask for so I guess the rose colored glasses pro Palin opinion is worth what I paid for it.
Be it Obama or McCain that is elected I have some pity for either of them given the incredible cluster F*** left behind by Bush and the Republicans that needs to be cleaned up.
ticklebug – that issue is old news and has been fully discredited.
Left Coast – “Your opinion of the whos and hows it will be better or worse under I didn’t ask for” – Oh, I get it, you want to give your opinion but you don’t want a response. OK, I’ll shut up then.
See ya.
My comment was out of line, apologies to you FandB. The DOW is getting the better of me….
No problem. The Dow can do that to you lately.
I agree with Ole Blue. Our society has been the most successful when both the capitalist and the socialist elements have been strong. Whatever direction our nation moves transparency will be critical.